THE BACHELORETTE - SEASON 12 - JOJO FLETCHER - **NO SPOILERS** - *SLEUTHING* DISCUSSION

Good morning loco . 

For me personally, I see no reason to go back there because I consider myself and am, in fact, unspoiled. The only difference I see between these threads and the other (and someone please CMIIW—correct me if I'm wrong) is:

- analyzing and speculation of the episodes, previews and possible outcomes based on what is shown by ABC and the storylines that took place in past seasons. This includes determining the final four by reason and deduction (in which we already have). 
- JoJo's People and Chris Harrison's Yahoo blogs signed off by ABC that a moderator brings over for us.
- the sharing of ideas and opinions and lots of laughs

I'm sure it is lonely over there and I'm confident that I can speak for all of the kind women on this side when I say, you would be more than welcome here if you wished.

Hi loco, I plan to stay here. I like the sleuthing aspect of it. Solving the puzzle before the show concludes is where I have my fun...but know that my record on actually doing this stinks. So know, even if we've think we've figured it out before the FRC, we really aren't 100% certain, unless we find the smoking gun. Days before Ben's FRC the spoiled side proved it by finding a cap with JoJo in the limo, based on dress color, after Ben said good-bye.

Thank you rhonda and litta you both make good points!!  There were a few of us in the unspoiled thread last year, but there wasn't the Sleuthing No Spoilers options, so maybe as long as no one is 100% completely calling out the F1 before the finale I will stick around.  I so enjoy reading everyone's perspective and how we all make our case for our favorites  

As a couple persons have theorized the possibility of Jordan leaving later on I went back to watch the episodes. In episode 5, on Jordan's first date they were talking about how long it took him to get a date etc. And JoJo asked him whether if he didn't get a date if he would have "thrown in the towel". To which, Jordan albeit jokingly responded, "you know what, I'm out". Then cues the ominous music. Then they change the scene to the hotel where the guys rag on him. I just thought it interesting that they left in the edit that he would leave if he found he was being strung along etc.

Loco, last season I went unspoiled and only stayed in the unspoiled thread. It was very difficult (and kind of quiet). I prefer being unspoiled (as described above) but also having the ability to analyze and discuss what we have seen in episodes and in preview clips. I have read nothing online, watched no tv interviews, read no magazine articles, looked at no social media, gotten no info from other members.

The only reason that we 'know' the final 4 men is because from the previews shown in episodes, members were able to identify locations - HTD and FD locations for some of the men. I personally like to know who the final 4 men are going to be. Most of the time I find it to be obvious in the editing, but it allows me to really focus (obsess) on a few of the relationships in more depth. I am interested in discussing these 'tv characters' and their 'storylines' and how it all unfolds. There is often a lot of looking forward, looking past, looking present, then looking past again, etc - in order to piece together those things. It is like solving a murder mystery, I suppose. 25 suspects, different motives and alibis, and enough blame to go around and around and around.

Last season when I watched unspoiled, I thought Ben was going to pick Jojo. My brain told me that Lauren might be the better fit for his life, but the interactions between him and Jojo were so good that I thought maybe he was going to go in another (less expected) direction. I don't mind being wrong. I know I don't really have all the facts. What I do mind is not being able to fully embrace this board and engage in very interesting discussions, debates, silliness. This season has been a lot of fun for me because of the variety of opinions and input from all of our great members. I am so happy and grateful that the moderators set up these non-spoiled/sleuthing threads.

MiaHawk wrote: This season has been a lot of fun for me because of the variety of opinions and input from all of our great members. I am so happy and grateful that the moderators set up these non-spoiled/sleuthing threads.    

^Yes! I've said it as many times as Jo's said that Jordan scares her: This season has been one of the best on the boards for me (just behind Maynard's because who can ever forget Ryguy? @Ladybug82. I have read articles that are recaps of episodes on blogs or sites that I normally follow or if friends send me them vetted for spoilers. Honestly, beyond this week's episode, I'm not really sure how we get from B.A. to HTDs. What happens in episode 7? Who is the 4th HTD? Outside of Chase and Robby in Thailand, it seems like everything there is a mystery, except that from sleuthing we seem to know that Jordan is at the FRC either because he is the 4th HTD or because he returns. Otherwise, it's all a puzzle still.

We've had such interesting theories, discussions, points of view, and impressive sleuthing. It's been such a lovely time Thanks for having me!

Thanks, mods!

aviej wrote:As a couple persons have theorized the possibility of Jordan leaving later on I went back to watch the episodes. In episode 5, on Jordan's first date they were talking about how long it took him to get a date etc. And JoJo asked him whether if he didn't get a date if he would have "thrown in the towel". To which, Jordan albeit jokingly responded, "you know what, I'm out". Then cues the ominous music. Then they change the scene to the hotel where the guys rag on him. I just thought it interesting that they left in the edit that he would leave if he found he was being strung along etc.

I'm really confused regarding Jordan leaving. I sleuthed that several of the guys were doing pickup PIs against the same backdrop: 10th post from the top. I'd propose that those pickups were done prior to the episode 8 HTD RC (F4-F3). They'd leave from LA to fly to Thailand. If Jordan's there in LA doing PIs, then he likely had a HTD. If all of that is true, the only chance for him to leave would be in Thailand a la Brooks (which would also mean that Luke is not in Thailand).   What are other alternatives?

Equally, I'm still curious about the lineup of dates in the next two episodes:

Episode 6: Buenos Aires 8 guys
1:1 with Wells (eliminated)
Group date: Soccer with Alex, Luke (rose), Jordan, James T., Robby
2:1 date with Chase (rose), Derek (eliminated)
RC: Chase and Luke have roses per caps; speculated that she keeps all 6 guys


Episode 7: Buenos Aires 6 guys
1:1 with Jordan (dinner ("I'm in love with you) and stair kiss)
1:1 with Alex (horseback)
Group date: ? (Robby's SQT)
RC: ? (Alex, James T eliminated)


Are there usually three 1:1s in the pre-HTD episode or two and 4 people on the group date? I thought that there were usually 3 people on a group date and one of them gets extra time, like Caila. Is there any chance that Robby is on the group date and wins the extra time with JoJo, which is basically the hotel canoodling session post-run-down-the-hall-in-my-underwear?

If Robby's on the group date, then two scenarios:
A) Three-people date: Robby, James T. Chase or Luke and another 1:1: Chase or Luke
B) Four-people date: Robby, James T., Chase, and Luke.

If it's scenario A, we have another 1:1 date. We don't seem to have caps for the group date or another 1:1, do we?

I've been thinking about this to veg, some extra caps we have are the 'bloody guy one' which I assumed was for a GD and the 'policia' cars-why would they include that? Maybe their doing some kind of crime/solve a mystery type date?

As to the pre-HTD's I thought there were usually 3 on GD and 2 1:1's. You're scenarios sound plausible.

I think we've seen it both ways. On Juan Pablo's season, there were 4 girls on the GD with Andi getting SQT. On Sean's, I recall only 3 on the GD. It was also the same (3 girls) on Brad's 2.0 GD.

We seen from the preview, though, that the show has already introduced the second 2-1...so I guess anything is possible this time around.

@veg_out I've also been sleuthing PIs and ITMs. The PIs (personal interview) of Jordan in the darker grey V-neck tee came from his intro package. I think it's also possible that these PIs with this backdrop were filmed after the season wrapped. We SEE him say in the clip below at:

• 0:50 - "...that the one woman I was in love with, wasn't in love with me anymore."
• 1:02 - "I'm really happy JoJo's the Bachelorette."
• 1:08 - "...I'm hoping I'm going to be JoJo's #1 draft pick."


Source

An intro pkg is an interesting place to put them. What do you think this tells us? (Luke doesn't have any with a backdrop other than in Texas.)

*ETA—There is a PI of Jordan with the same backdrop and tee at the pool party. I'm just trying to find a clip of what he says there. 

**PS—Did you all know that there are 24 different backdrops to date that are not an obvious date location?! 

If anyone else would like to sleuth anymore backdrops, it would be a good idea to somewhat coordinate our efforts so we don't double or quadruple our time spent on the same ones. I know what episodes each PI backdrop takes place in (but not what they said yet) for JoJo and the final 4. Whoever wants to help with this, I can tell you what episode(s) they're in so you wouldn't have to do extra hunting for them.

^^I'm curious. How many different guys have this back drop? If I had to guess, I'd say this was back at the mansion during the time of the HTDs. The guys who are aren't at their HTs often wait back at a central location (usually the mansion) and do PIs. If we only have Robby, Chase or Luke with these and no one else, then I think this is our F4 guys during the HTDs.

ETA: Oops, I forgot to add the backdrop I'm referring to.


my SC from the above YT.

Litta123 wrote:^^I'm curious. How many different guys have this back drop? If I had to guess, I'd say this was back at the mansion during the time of the HTDs. The guys who are aren't at their HTs often wait back at a central location (usually the mansion) and do PIs. If we only have Robby, Chase or Luke with these and no one else, then I think this is our F4 guys during the HTDs.

ETA: Oops, I forgot to add the backdrop I'm referring to.


my SC from the above YT.

Litta, I explained in the 10th post from the top that the caps are from later in the season. I showed that Robby is talking about the Heinz field date, which happened in Pittsburgh not at the mansion. The post explains it.

It's always possible that they were done after the season, but I have a strong sense that they were done pre-HTD RC like we've seen in previous seasons.