The Bachelor 20 - Ben Higgins - General Discussion - *Sleuthing - Spoilers* #3

CH was going on about "Mesnick" for Kaitlyn's season too and it ended up being Chris Cupcake crying in Ireland.
I think it's all much ado about nothing and just CH's and co's way to try drum up drama.
Because after Olivia goes what drama is there really?
They have to have something and Ben showed on K's season he is up to the task of doing what needs to be done on the show for TPTB.

Well... the blindside discussion is still interesting. This could mean something very simple: Jo-Jo decides to take herself out if she isn't feeling "IT" with him. Or... maybe he was informed by a handler that she is a future lead and he lets it slip that he will carry her almost to the end. I really don't know if this is something important or not. It was a weird comment... but, then again, a lot of weird comments are made on reality TV shows that involve SOME "staging" and "acting". (Don't try to convince me EVERYTHING on this show is unscripted.)

JBF wrote:
The BIG event of this episode was Jubilee getting dumped on the group date. It happened completely out of nowhere with limited warning, but... again... so many of her scenes with Ben had a lot of lop and chop anyway. It is fair to say she was more into him than he was into her, although I do think she was part of his initial top two... with Lauren Bee... and he juggled the two for a little bit before making his decision by week four or five. Usually by this time, you can sense where the wind is blowing. I did not "buy" Ben's claim that Jubilee was the one "pulling back". He just needed an excuse to beak up with her and look like it isn't his fault. This is starting to bug me about Ben. He is never wrong about anything. Just the ladies.

Ben and Lauren Bee hardly "wow" me with their scenes, but since he lacks any real interest in the other ladies, she really is the ONLY contender I can see at this point.

I haven't seen this episode yet but I have to agree that at one point he definitely was into Jubilee. If that interest was romantic versus more on the "she is a fascinating person" side I don't know, but I LOVED the way he was with her on their one on one date, and how he stood up for her later that episode. We saw a more interesting and animated side of Ben with her in that earlier episode, I thought.

And, yes, the "it" that he and Lauren have is obvious, but also not able to transcend the screen, so it ends up flat to view, just lots of gushy words and starring. Maybe it is just me, but their chemistry doesn't invite me to enter into it with them, as has been true with some past couples.

JBF wrote:You know... I thought this episode dragged after Jubilee left, but there are "little things" that have me curious.

For one thing, Harrison is obsessed with Jason Mesnick in his after shows this season. Mighty curious why. We saw more footage from his season rehashed than the others.

Did I hear this correctly or did Ben tell Jo-Jo that he would never "blindside" her?

Isn't that what he does with ALL of the women apart from his F1? Jo-Jo even counted how many ladies were left... which I also found rather strange.

Something seems fishy here... but we need to think about this more.

I agree, JBF. Something is just not jelling right for me. LaurenB is being served up to us on a silver platter. From getting out of the limo and getting the "great way to start the night" comment, the things he said to her the first night, the gift photo that he gave her the second episode to tell her he was thinking about her even though he didn't see her that week, telling her how lucky he is that she is there, then Monday on the After Show, just after they showed the new "shocking" preview, they plaster a tweet up on the screen that read something like, LaurenB and Ben are like Cinderella and Prince Charming #itsfate. It is like they are subliminally messaging that it's LaurenB for some reason. How could it be MF's favorite season since Jason's (another reference to Jason) if it is so straight forward and obvious? Because MF is such a romantic? I think not! Something is looming out on the horizon and it's still too far away to see clearly what it is.

Just as you said, how could he possibly say to JoJo that he promised he wouldn't blindside her.....even repeated it. Old sleuthers from before RS and social media that really spent a lot of time searching for clues used to always say that everything is included for a reason.

Most of the leads say that they are in love with two and the choice is just too difficult to make and they don't know what they are going to do. That in itself, means nothing as has been shown season after season. Being very distraught putting someone in a limo during the finale, happens every season unless the F2 is let go early. So how could it be that there is something that has never happened before. ChrisH alone saying that, means nothing, but Ben agreed. Are ratings down and they need to be jacked up?

It could be that he ends up with Lauren, but in a circumvent way.

Also, Ben's demeanor after the preview was shown was strange to me for someone who just watched back what they want us to believe was a very painful and gut wrenching experience.

For a dull season with a too obvious front-runner, it does seem odd that there is so much "insinuation" that Ben is sssssoooooo indecisive.

Jimmy Kimmel jokingly was alternating between Jo-Jo and Lauren B on his sitdown interview with Ben.

The silly McDonald commercials show him even more indecisive. Chris Soules peers over his shoulder "You gotta make a decision at some point, man", then Desie warning him to "choose wisely" as Prince Siegfried responds "SHE did!"... and Catherine feeding Sean french fries ("She likes breakfast and he likes lunch").

I probably "read too much" on the heavy emphasis on Jason Mesnick this season, both as a visitor in the beginning and in so many "down memory lane" visits.

I think the Mesnick is just a wannabe foiler and put out there to try to make things more dramatic than they seem. I also think Ben's words of blindside were left in the edit so as to create doubt and so they could be talking points brought up at the ATFR.

moonchild wrote:

JBF wrote:You know... I thought this episode dragged after Jubilee left, but there are "little things" that have me curious.

For one thing, Harrison is obsessed with Jason Mesnick in his after shows this season. Mighty curious why. We saw more footage from his season rehashed than the others.

Did I hear this correctly or did Ben tell Jo-Jo that he would never "blindside" her?

Isn't that what he does with ALL of the women apart from his F1? Jo-Jo even counted how many ladies were left... which I also found rather strange.

Something seems fishy here... but we need to think about this more.

I agree, JBF.  Something is just not jelling right for me.  LaurenB is being served up to us on a silver platter.   

 

I would agree if all we had were the latest preview... 

but I go back to the season's previews, where we see every one of the F4 (F6?) girls telling Ben they loved him/are in love with him EXCEPT Lauren B. Most of the FD/LCDs/Sexy kissing previews where the girl is recognisable are also Caila (more than any), Jojo or other. The only ones of Lauren B are either from the back, or no head/face shown (i.e. random blonde). I often find the first season preview is the most telling. 

Everything after the show starts hearing is reactive to public reactions. In this case... "what, it's too obvious between ben and LB? let's throw a spanner in the works" .

I also thought there is probably a reason they don't show her saying it...

moonchild wrote:

JBF wrote:You know... I thought this episode dragged after Jubilee left, but there are "little things" that have me curious.

For one thing, Harrison is obsessed with Jason Mesnick in his after shows this season. Mighty curious why. We saw more footage from his season rehashed than the others.

Did I hear this correctly or did Ben tell Jo-Jo that he would never "blindside" her?

Isn't that what he does with ALL of the women apart from his F1? Jo-Jo even counted how many ladies were left... which I also found rather strange.

Something seems fishy here... but we need to think about this more.

I agree, JBF.  Something is just not jelling right for me.  LaurenB is being served up to us on a silver platter.  From getting out of the limo and getting the "great way to start the night" comment, the things he said to her the first night, the gift photo that he gave her the second episode to tell her he was thinking about her even though he didn't see her that week, telling her how lucky he is that she is there,  then Monday on the After Show, just after they showed the new "shocking" preview, they plaster a tweet up on the screen that read something like, LaurenB and Ben are like Cinderella and Prince Charming #itsfate.  It is like they are subliminally messaging that it's LaurenB for some reason.  How could it be MF's favorite season since Jason's (another reference to Jason) if it is so straight forward and obvious?  Because MF is such a romantic?  I think not!  Something is looming out on the horizon and it's still too far away to see clearly what it is.  

Just as you said, how could he possibly say to JoJo that he promised he wouldn't blindside her.....even repeated it.  Old sleuthers from before RS and social media that really spent a lot of time searching for clues used to always say that everything is included for a reason.  

Most of the leads say that they are in love with two and the choice is just too difficult to make and they don't know what they are going to do.  That in itself, means nothing as has been shown season after season.  Being very distraught putting someone in a limo during the finale, happens every season unless the F2 is let go early.  So how could it be that there is something that has never happened before.  ChrisH alone saying that, means nothing, but Ben agreed.  Are ratings down and they need to be jacked up?

It could be that he ends up with Lauren, but in a circumvent way.

Also, Ben's demeanor after the preview was shown was strange to me for someone who just watched back what they want us to believe was a very painful and gut wrenching experience.  

What was Ben's demeanor after the preview?

A spoiler hasn't been wrong lately (will this season be a foil or a switcheroo?)
It has the potential to be based on what I'm seeing from a personal & an editing standpoint.
Ben's ease & physical chemistry around JoJo reminds me of Jolly a 'la Mesnicks, with LB standing in as Melissa Ry. Ben is so goo-goo over her! He seems nervous and not himself, much like J.Mesnick around Melissa.
This season is so BLAHHHHHH (yawn) that I am seriously hoping for something (anything!!) major later.

eversotrue wrote:

moonchild wrote:

JBF wrote:You know... I thought this episode dragged after Jubilee left, but there are "little things" that have me curious.

For one thing, Harrison is obsessed with Jason Mesnick in his after shows this season. Mighty curious why. We saw more footage from his season rehashed than the others.

Did I hear this correctly or did Ben tell Jo-Jo that he would never "blindside" her?

Isn't that what he does with ALL of the women apart from his F1? Jo-Jo even counted how many ladies were left... which I also found rather strange.

Something seems fishy here... but we need to think about this more.

I agree, JBF.  Something is just not jelling right for me.  LaurenB is being served up to us on a silver platter.  From getting out of the limo and getting the "great way to start the night" comment, the things he said to her the first night, the gift photo that he gave her the second episode to tell her he was thinking about her even though he didn't see her that week, telling her how lucky he is that she is there,  then Monday on the After Show, just after they showed the new "shocking" preview, they plaster a tweet up on the screen that read something like, LaurenB and Ben are like Cinderella and Prince Charming #itsfate.  It is like they are subliminally messaging that it's LaurenB for some reason.  How could it be MF's favorite season since Jason's (another reference to Jason) if it is so straight forward and obvious?  Because MF is such a romantic?  I think not!  Something is looming out on the horizon and it's still too far away to see clearly what it is.  

Just as you said, how could he possibly say to JoJo that he promised he wouldn't blindside her.....even repeated it.  Old sleuthers from before RS and social media that really spent a lot of time searching for clues used to always say that everything is included for a reason.  

Most of the leads say that they are in love with two and the choice is just too difficult to make and they don't know what they are going to do.  That in itself, means nothing as has been shown season after season.  Being very distraught putting someone in a limo during the finale, happens every season unless the F2 is let go early.  So how could it be that there is something that has never happened before.  ChrisH alone saying that, means nothing, but Ben agreed.  Are ratings down and they need to be jacked up?

It could be that he ends up with Lauren, but in a circumvent way.

Also, Ben's demeanor after the preview was shown was strange to me for someone who just watched back what they want us to believe was a very painful and gut wrenching experience.  

What was Ben's demeanor after the preview?

Well, to me it looked like he had a smile on his face immediately after the clip. Maybe that's not what others see. He certainly didn't look like he had just re-lived a recent painful moment in his life. And, I'm not trying to be critical of him, it's just that it seemed odd to me.

moonchild wrote:

eversotrue wrote:

moonchild wrote:


I agree, JBF.  Something is just not jelling right for me.  LaurenB is being served up to us on a silver platter.  From getting out of the limo and getting the "great way to start the night" comment, the things he said to her the first night, the gift photo that he gave her the second episode to tell her he was thinking about her even though he didn't see her that week, telling her how lucky he is that she is there,  then Monday on the After Show, just after they showed the new "shocking" preview, they plaster a tweet up on the screen that read something like, LaurenB and Ben are like Cinderella and Prince Charming #itsfate.  It is like they are subliminally messaging that it's LaurenB for some reason.  How could it be MF's favorite season since Jason's (another reference to Jason) if it is so straight forward and obvious?  Because MF is such a romantic?  I think not!  Something is looming out on the horizon and it's still too far away to see clearly what it is.  

Just as you said, how could he possibly say to JoJo that he promised he wouldn't blindside her.....even repeated it.  Old sleuthers from before RS and social media that really spent a lot of time searching for clues used to always say that everything is included for a reason.  

Most of the leads say that they are in love with two and the choice is just too difficult to make and they don't know what they are going to do.  That in itself, means nothing as has been shown season after season.  Being very distraught putting someone in a limo during the finale, happens every season unless the F2 is let go early.  So how could it be that there is something that has never happened before.  ChrisH alone saying that, means nothing, but Ben agreed.  Are ratings down and they need to be jacked up?

It could be that he ends up with Lauren, but in a circumvent way.

Also, Ben's demeanor after the preview was shown was strange to me for someone who just watched back what they want us to believe was a very painful and gut wrenching experience.  

What was Ben's demeanor after the preview?

Well, to me it looked like he had a smile on his face immediately after the clip.  Maybe that's not what others see.  He certainly didn't look like he had just re-lived a recent painful moment in his life.  And, I'm not trying to be critical of him, it's just that it seemed odd to me.

I noticed right after it finished, he looked stoned faced. But then as he started talking, he went back to his regular way of speaking. And actually, I think, when he gets awkward/embarrassed/doesn't know what to do.. He awkwardly smiles. I've noticed it a few times. Just me..?