The Bachelor 20 - Ben Higgins - General Discussion - *Sleuthing - Spoilers* #3

It's more about the early hype of Ben SAYING ily to both early on. It's like we were being led to believe that it's the F2. But not necessarily . He has feelings for Jojo but doesn't mean he'll tell her in the FD or LCD imo. The FRC might just be about how he loved one more but not that he told both.

sophienette wrote:My 2 cents:

I agree. I think he told another woman he loved her in the FS and they havent (yet?) showed it, then the next day, green t-shirt, he realizes what he did, ("ITM "I told 2 women this week I loved them") followed by the crying on the ground, then dumping F3 - who I guess is Caila and who he would have said ILU too... which would explain his blog about the break up being at a weird time...

I like this notion. Perhaps they can't show the second ILU because they don't have it on film and only found out about it about it when Ben realizes - after the fact - the mistake he had made.

Lucas15 wrote:

sophienette wrote:My 2 cents:

I agree. I think he told another woman he loved her in the FS and they havent (yet?) showed it, then the next day, green t-shirt, he realizes what he did, ("ITM "I told 2 women this week I loved them") followed by the crying on the ground, then dumping F3 - who I guess is Caila and who he would have said ILU too... which would explain his blog about the break up being at a weird time...

I like this notion. Perhaps they can't show the second ILU because they don't have it on film and only found out about it about it when Ben realizes - after the fact - the mistake he had made.

Actually, I am fairly certain that they do have it on film. I THINK that I heard Chris H say on an interview (possibly Huffington as that's the only one I listened last week) where he said that producers had to tell Ben he had said I Love You to two girls ... as if Ben had not even realized it slipped out.

Bottom line is that boy looks exhausted and so easily susceptible to producer manipulation at this point of sleep deprivation.

I would not at all be surprised if TPTB pressured Ben to "put on a show" as the lead with Caila and Jo Jo, which would account for the extra stress he looks under, in order to get his prize (Lauren) in the end.

NCGalBecca wrote:Will that fly with the casual viewing audience..keeping JoJo around..if Caila is indeed the second ILY? If he says it twice (in any capacity), wouldn't the producers want those 2 girls in the F2 to promote the suspense of who he is going to pick in the finale?  As obvious as it is re: who Ben is likely picking, they still have two hours to fill and viewers to retain.

Unless the finale is filled with the fallout and clean up..kinda like on Ali's season when Frank bolted and then she sent Chris packing and had her FRC with Roberto.

Sometimes I think that the "real" f2 ends up going earlier for any number of reasons. After last night's episode, I would still put Lauren far in the lead and the adorable Caila seems like his true F2. Betting that TPTB realized that Caila was a dream come true as the perfect gorgeous/bubbly choice for their first non-white Bachelorette so she got the boot at F3 to pave the way for her stint as 'ette and crowd support at WTA.

What's hilarious is when you hear past contestants talk about the shuffling that takes place when it comes down to Final 1-4. CHris Lambton said on a recent podcast (link posted on Chris/Peyton thread here) with his wife Peyton that both he and Roberto were surprised when Frank left as they both thought he would be F1. Chris was asked whether he thought Roberto and Alli would last at the engagement, and he said "no." He also said that he and Roberto had a conversation, after Frank left, wondering who was going to be F1 ... Roberto or Chris, which cracks me up as Chris made it sound like it would not have been a big deal to either one of them who Ali ended up picking.

Same with Jason Mesnick who has said on his podcast that he was supposed to go at F4 but then Graham bolted early. Next thing you know he got pushed to the F2 spot. So ... go figure.

TPTB seem willing to do all kinds of angling at the end to ensure they have the perfect exit for their next lead.

I wonder how early on the lead has to tell them their F1. With Ven it mightve been fairly early on.

Fingersandtoes wrote:I wonder how early on the lead has to tell them their F1. With Ven it mightve been fairly early on.

I think they start asking the lead for their favorites after night one and then consistently through out the process but I don't think they have to decide until FRC week.

Fingersandtoes wrote:I wonder how early on the lead has to tell them their F1. With Ven it mightve been fairly early on.

There's no set time for each lead since they are all different. Some may know early on and some probably don't decide until the day of the FRC.

So the "I do love you" he's wearing the same blue shirt as the one he's wearing with Lauren kissing AND her hair is visible in the the "I've known I've been in love with you as well". Hmm.... Could he have just told HER???

MVMom39forever wrote:

... snipped...

I would not at all be surprised if TPTB pressured Ben to "put on a show" as the lead with Caila and Jo Jo, which would account for the extra stress he looks under, in order to get his prize (Lauren) in the end.  

When I was watching Lolo's HTD live, that is exactly what I thought...(Italic is exactly what we see them say, bold is what I think are key points)

Mollie: Like how do I know you're not saying this to all these other families. Like "Oh I love your daughter and our first date was awesome"

Hinting he just did to her?

Ben: But if I'm on one knee and I'm asking Lauren to marry me at the end, it is because I mean it. And like, I'm committing to that
(the second part of that sentence, if we were to play TPTB and cut it....  :shocked!: )

Ben to Lolo's dad: if i'm down on one knee at the end of this it will be because it's real. And.. at this point with Lauren, it's more real than I ever thought I could ever feel

tennischick80 wrote:Perhaps he has sex with Jojo because he knows he's going into a full blown relationship with perhaps the only woman he'll be with for the rest of his life (Lauren). If he told Lauren he would be celibate, then she'd have a right to be mad. It may be painful, of course, it would because if at the end of this, he professes his love for her, she'll wonder, "If you loved me so much just a week/2 ago, why sleep with Jojo/Caila?" If she asks him and he's honest with her (she has ways for finding out), that's critical for their relationship. It spells doom if he tries to cover it up, and it leaks with verification that he did have sex with more than just she. That's the loophole of this show- it sucks for the F1/F2 (whomever involved), but technically he isn't exclusive with any one of them.

I've noticed that the F1 Usually gets the last Fantasy date. So if he did engage in sex with the other two it's in the past ( so to speak).and anything he does with his F1 on fantasy date she becomes the last one and only one moving forward and it gives the lead the edge as to not make his F1 feel like he cheated before he gets down on one knee. It's crazy but in this fantasy reality world of "The Bachelor" I guess it can help the F1 mentally know that anything he did before he commited to her dosen't matter. I just hope Ben dosen't have sex with the two that he isn't picking. AS far as Lauren I don't think he'll be able to hold back with her, it seems to me that the attraction is heating up so much with these two the entire time and if he loves her as much as he seems to then he'll explode in that fantasy suite. jmo :Nod:

^^^ Is the next episode description out to see who they will show as the last FD? We can usually tell based on the date descriptions.

Lucas15 wrote:

sophienette wrote:My 2 cents:

I agree. I think he told another woman he loved her in the FS and they havent (yet?) showed it, then the next day, green t-shirt, he realizes what he did, ("ITM "I told 2 women this week I loved them") followed by the crying on the ground, then dumping F3 - who I guess is Caila and who he would have said ILU too... which would explain his blog about the break up being at a weird time...

I like this notion. Perhaps they can't show the second ILU because they don't have it on film and only found out about it about it when Ben realizes - after the fact - the mistake he had made.

I think he tells one " I do love you" and the other " I've know for a while that I'm "falling in love" with you too" . Big difference. I think he says I do love you to JoJo ( as a friend) and the "falling in love" to Lauren ( the one). jmo