Re: Episode 11 - 8/1 Finale - Discussion - Thread #2

[Starshine_16]

Since there were comments about pecks with Ben, what do you all think about Ashley's comment to Ben in the mud bath about wishing she could reach lower? I thought it was very suggestive and surprised me since she knew she'd be getting engaged to another guy in a day or two. Perhaps Ben had good reason to think he was "the one". I think there was possibly a lot more chemistry with Ben than people think.

My honest opinion about Ashley's comment in that preview and also the whole suntan lotion scene in the FD is that Ashley's comments sounded forced and unnatural, like she was overcompensating for a lack of actual heat with suggestive comments. There was something about her delivery of those lines that made them sound insincere to me, it was a combination of the cadence being different from how she normally speaks and her being louder than usual I think. But all that means to me is Ashley was emotionally disengaged because by that point she had made her choice. It does NOT mean she wasn't attracted to Ben F, didn't care for him, didn't have real feelings for him, or anything like that.

I just don't think it's as simple as saying either Ashley was faking it with Ben F because of the producers or she was still legitimately considering him as a F1 possibility. But by the HTDs, I think Ashley knew she was picking JP and by necessity that meant shutting off a part of herself to Ben F. She didn't want to make him feel unwelcome or unwanted because she valued his friendship, was attracted to him, and sincerely cared for him. She wanted him to feel wanted because he was her real F2 but at the same time, a big part of her was closed off to him because she knew he wasn't going to be her F1.

I agree. Especially with the bolded. I think it was easier for Ashley to make 'flirty' comments than to actually have to have frank discussions with Ben. She did like him and I don't think wanted to hurt him, (I think they had a great friendship at this point) but her heart was with JP.

I'm sorry but that went beyond flirty. It was very suggestive and didn't sound forced to me nor do I think she was talking about not being able to reach the mud that someone else suggested. It was all mud in there. :laughingoutlou I'm not calling Ashley a tease but can see why Ben would be confused.

It's certainly up to all of us to decide what we think of the video Ben was in however I think there's a lot of people who find it funny including Shawntel from last season. It's not my thing but I'm sure my sons would laugh. I do object to dismissing Ben as a "frat boy". I've noticed a tendency to do that with him and I'm not sure what it means other than as a way of dismissing him. He was in a fraternity but he's also a business owner who takes it very seriously. He was also talked about very favorably by friends and others in Sonoma who know a lot more about him than we do. I'm sure he likes to have fun and have seen that with him & also Ashley but don't we all? :Nod:

Thank you albean for saying what I have been wanting to say but have been unable to find the right words.

[Guest]

GrahamGal wrote
I think everyone knows that Ben is not a threat to JP and Ashley. We are just openly discussing things on a forum for such discussions. Nothing more nothing less. We are looking for things to discuss while we wait for the finale..

[Peppermom]

Since there were comments about pecks with Ben, what do you all think about Ashley's comment to Ben in the mud bath about wishing she could reach lower? I thought it was very suggestive and surprised me since she knew she'd be getting engaged to another guy in a day or two. Perhaps Ben had good reason to think he was "the one". I think there was possibly a lot more chemistry with Ben than people think.

My honest opinion about Ashley's comment in that preview and also the whole suntan lotion scene in the FD is that Ashley's comments sounded forced and unnatural, like she was overcompensating for a lack of actual heat with suggestive comments. There was something about her delivery of those lines that made them sound insincere to me, it was a combination of the cadence being different from how she normally speaks and her being louder than usual I think. But all that means to me is Ashley was emotionally disengaged because by that point she had made her choice. It does NOT mean she wasn't attracted to Ben F, didn't care for him, didn't have real feelings for him, or anything like that.

I just don't think it's as simple as saying either Ashley was faking it with Ben F because of the producers or she was still legitimately considering him as a F1 possibility. But by the HTDs, I think Ashley knew she was picking JP and by necessity that meant shutting off a part of herself to Ben F. She didn't want to make him feel unwelcome or unwanted because she valued his friendship, was attracted to him, and sincerely cared for him. She wanted him to feel wanted because he was her real F2 but at the same time, a big part of her was closed off to him because she knew he wasn't going to be her F1.

I agree. Especially with the bolded. I think it was easier for Ashley to make 'flirty' comments than to actually have to have frank discussions with Ben. She did like him and I don't think wanted to hurt him, (I think they had a great friendship at this point) but her heart was with JP.

I'm sorry but that went beyond flirty. It was very suggestive and didn't sound forced to me nor do I think she was talking about not being able to reach the mud that someone else suggested. It was all mud in there. :laughingoutlou I'm not calling Ashley a tease but can see why Ben would be confused.

It's certainly up to all of us to decide what we think of the video Ben was in however I think there's a lot of people who find it funny including Shawntel from last season. It's not my thing but I'm sure my sons would laugh. I do object to dismissing Ben as a "frat boy". I've noticed a tendency to do that with him and I'm not sure what it means other than as a way of dismissing him. He was in a fraternity but he's also a business owner who takes it very seriously. He was also talked about very favorably by friends and others in Sonoma who know a lot more about him than we do. I'm sure he likes to have fun and have seen that with him & also Ashley but don't we all? :Nod:

Thank you albean for saying what I have been wanting to say but have been unable to find the right words.

I so agree with this. Just because it isn't my taste doesn't diminish him as a person, business owner or generally all around great guy. I really appreciate everyone allowing me to have my opinion and not attack me for it. :thanki:

[Guest]

There is no need to dismiss Ben in any way. JP is F1. Ben is no threat to cupcake so why not just let it go? I love gracious winners. LOL

ITA as well...

[Guest]

There is no need to dismiss Ben in any way. JP is F1. Ben is no threat to cupcake so why not just let it go? I love gracious winners. LOL

I think when non JP fans stop diminishing JP and Ashley's love for each other and stop blaming Ashley for being horrible at the FRC, maybe folks could 'let it go'. It's a two way street. And I love gracious losers.

[mlm707]

Hello all, I realize it's a tad late in the season,but I joined anyway Great board,couldn't help it.

[Peppermom]

There is no need to dismiss Ben in any way. JP is F1. Ben is no threat to cupcake so why not just let it go? I love gracious winners. LOL

ITA as well...

If you took my post as dismissing Ben, that certainly wasn't my intention. I don't dismiss anyone. It's all good.

[Peppermom]

Hello all, I realize it's a tad late in the season,but I joined anyway Great board,couldn't help it.

Glad you made it.

[chicagoowl]

GrahamGal wrote
I think everyone knows that Ben is not a threat to JP and Ashley. We are just openly discussing things on a forum for such discussions. Nothing more nothing less. We are looking for things to discuss while we wait for the finale..

I like Ben.. but he was in a different place in his life. I think now after being on The Bachelorette he is ready for a more mature relationship. He had to deal with his family issues first....I think now he's grown up a bit.

[Guest]

I've not read all the posts in this thread yet, so if this is repetitious, I do apologize. Some thoughts on ben's blunt words as he departs from Ashley.

A walk down memory lane. During the FRC of Meredith's season, I remember initially being quite favorably impressed at the very gracious response from her F2 when she told him he was not the one - "If you have stronger feelings for someone else, then you shouldn't be with me." (Possible paraphrase after all these years, and it is probably pathetic that I even remember approximately what he said.) Then, at the ATFR, he did a total turn around and was petulant and pouty, and, IMO, really sucked up a lot of air time that I would have preferred to have spent on the at-the-time-happy couple.

From the information in the invisible ink posts, it sounds as if Ben's emotions had recuperated to a fair degree by the time the ATFR was filmed if he was able to kid with her about her "nice ring." Good for him. He seems, as portrayed anyway, as a very fine young man who has come away from this weird experience with some needed emotional growth and willingness to be open that will stand him in good stead from now on. I hope so.

One thing I definitely admired from Andrew Firestone's season was his statement to his F2 and how he didn't shilly-shally around; how direct he was - "I've fallen in love with Jen." It bugs me when the Bach/B'ette says uses weasle words like "I've fallen in love with/have stronger feelings for someone else." Gee, whoever might that be??? Like the F2 doesn't know exactly who that someone else is. Just say the name!

[Love_Me]

mlm707 and cattrick1951! Glad you both joined the site!

[Diana]

Ahhhh. I'm SO excited for the finale! :missclap:

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