The Bachelorette 11 - Kaitlyn Bristowe - Epi 9 July 13th - *Sleuthing - Spoilers*

Lucas15 wrote:

MiaHawk wrote:Isn't it reasonable to say that K's behavior after sex with N was all driven by her fear of S's reaction, including the possibility that he'd leave her?

IMO it's partly reasonable. When Kaitlyn told Shawn she'd had sex with Nick Shawn's first words were a fascinating study in emotional maturity - he asked in a very calm and collected tone of voice "Do you regret it?" Her answer to that question would tell him all he needs to know to make a decision to leave - or stay. Her answer was "I feel guilty" - it was probably not the answer he expected and maybe not the answer he wanted but it was an equally great answer.

So I wouldn't say that Kaitlyn's behavior was driven by fear of Shawn's reaction - it was driven by her guilt over what she'd done to someone she cared a great deal for, and her own fear that it could cost her what she really wanted out of the experience.

How you feel and what you think after being intimate with someone are so telling. In Kaitlyn's case, her mind went to Shawn, and what he would think. She may not have known until then just how serious her feelings were.

IMO - Mature is not a word I would pick to describe Shawn or Kaitlyn based on what I have seen this season. I am sure Kaitlyn was worried about how Shawn would react but not to worried since she went back to the Nick buffet for 2nd's and 3rd's.......

Seabear wrote:IMO - Mature is not a word I would pick to describe Shawn or Kaitlyn based on what I have seen this season.  I am sure Kaitlyn was worried about how Shawn would react but not to worried since she went back to the Nick buffet for 2nd's and 3rd's.......  

By the promo.She looked pretty cozy with Nick on the boat and back at the suite on their LCD.

Hotmomma wrote:

Seabear wrote:IMO - Mature is not a word I would pick to describe Shawn or Kaitlyn based on what I have seen this season.  I am sure Kaitlyn was worried about how Shawn would react but not to worried since she went back to the Nick buffet for 2nd's and 3rd's.......  

By the promo.She looked pretty cozy with Nick on the boat and back at the suite on their LCD.

I love the N move...hand on butt.

My thoughts on Monday's episode:

Of the two overnights, I felt that Ben got the far better draw in terms of setting, activities, and fantasy suite (I could almost sense Kaitlyn's disappointment when she saw the FS at the golf resort by comparison. It was bound to be a letdown after that gorgeous castle.) I thought that her date with Ben was very romantic, but when Kaitlyn called him "cute," that told me everything I needed to know about where he stood in the scheme of things. IMO you don't call a man you are passionate about "cute." Ben continued being his polite, kind, classy, unflappable self.

Shawn's golf date -- what the heck was the head of wardrobe thinking when she put him in that gaudy getup? I wouldn't dress my worst enemy in those colors. If they wanted him to show up better against the green golf course, a bright shirt and khaki pants would have worked just fine. The streaking -- my only thought was that some producer had won a bet or was otherwise getting "paid." Shawn does have a very nice body, however.

What I found totally curious was Shawn's body language when he was walking away after his overnight. By contrast, Ben was jaunty and happy walking back to his lodgings after his overnight. Shawn was both slouching and stalking as he walked. It was not the body language of a happy man who had just spent the night with his beloved. And this was before Nick came into his sight.

Shawn's "talk" with Nick was mostly Shawn venting his spleen with no concrete examples to back up his complaints. I thought that Nick stayed calm and cool and handled it as well as could be expected.

Family visits -- I thought that both visits went well. I didn't mind so much that they didn't go to the men's hometowns. I liked both families but I *loved* Nick's family. Their love and concern for him was very touching. One thing that became apparent to me during the visit with Shawn's family was that he was probably always the front-runner. He and Kaitlyn felt a strong attraction to each other, they liked each other, done deal. I get that. Whether that makes Shawn the best selection for her remains to be seen.

As for the next bachelor -- as much as I like and respect Ben H., I'm not completely sold. I worry that his personality may be a little too flat for TV, and that he's not quite as verbal in expressing his feelings as one might like. I'm probably more interested in Ben Z. or Jared. But...I've gone from not liking Nick at all in Andi's season to gradually being won over. I'd love to see him get a shot at being the lead. I think the fact that two bachelorettes have brought him to the final two speaks very well of him. I'd love to see him with a woman who can fully appreciate what he has to offer.

dw_a_mom wrote:How you feel and what you think after being intimate with someone are so telling. In Kaitlyn's case, her mind went to Shawn, and what he would think. She may not have known until then just how serious her feelings were.

You know I've wrestled for a long time trying to figure out exactly why Kaitlyn had sex with Nick when she did, and the best I have ever been able to come up with is that Kaitlyn was in "dating mode". She had the show whispering in her ear that:

"this process works if you let it. You have to concentrate on who you are with and let that relationship progress as though it was the only relationship you are in. That way at the end you are able to figure out which relationship is the right one for you. Getting too focused on one relationship too soon may leave you with nothing if that person turns out not to be who you thought they were."

Now IMO this is one huge line of BS and while it sounds like it makes perfect sense to most leads, it's really how the show gets the lead to give real emotions and affection to a bunch of different people and makes for good TV. But it makes for lousy trust between the lead and anybody. But - this is what put Kaitlyn in "dating mode" and when Kaitlyn is in dating mode and she likes the person she's with and she has the opportunity, she'll have sex with them. I'm not saying I agree with her, but I think this is how she thinks and that's how she thought and it seemed a perfectly logical thing for her to do with Nick.

Until the next morning when reality hit her - and she was more sober - and as you suggest - thinking about the possible repercussions of what she had did and the effect it would have on the relationship she wanted out of the experience overshadowed any other relationship.

If I remember correctly kaitlyn start showing her regret when someone on the side of the building start whispering to her the morning after nick. She came out on the balcony smiling.

Lucas15 wrote:

dw_a_mom wrote:How you feel and what you think after being intimate with someone are so telling. In Kaitlyn's case, her mind went to Shawn, and what he would think. She may not have known until then just how serious her feelings were.

You know I've wrestled for a long time trying to figure out exactly why Kaitlyn had sex with Nick when she did, and the best I have ever been able to come up with is that Kaitlyn was in "dating mode". She had the show whispering in her ear that:

"this process works if you let it. You have to concentrate on who you are with and let that relationship progress as though it was the only relationship you are in. That way at the end you are able to figure out which relationship is the right one for you. Getting too focused on one relationship too soon may leave you with nothing if that person turns out not to be who you thought they were."

Now IMO this is one huge line of BS and while it sounds like it makes perfect sense to most leads, it's really how the show gets the lead to give real emotions and affection to a bunch of different people and makes for good TV. But it makes for lousy trust between the lead and anybody. But - this is what put Kaitlyn in "dating mode" and when Kaitlyn is in dating mode and she likes the person she's with and she has the opportunity, she'll have sex with them. I'm not saying I agree with her, but I think this is how she thinks and that's how she thought and it seemed a perfectly logical thing for her to do with Nick.

Until the next morning when reality hit her - and she was more sober - and as you suggest - thinking about the possible repercussions of what she had did and the effect it would have on the relationship she wanted out of the experience overshadowed any other relationship.

With all due respect, I think Kaitlyn had sex with Nick because she really really wanted to. I'm sure there had been some serious sexual tension ever since they started talking and lord knows what else, so when the opportunity presented itself to release said tension, she jumped right into it. Understandable. And I guess it was good, since she went for 2nds (and possibly 3rds).

I think that Kaitlyn was confused to the last minute.

Seeing her behavior and her regret of sorts with Shawn is like a huge sign letting us sleuthers know she meant it when she told Shawn he was "The One" and that he is F1 only solidifies that. But we are watching this from the outside, not living it in the moment.

It's why I think, in Kaitlyn's head - where she "lives in the moment" - she very well could have told someone else they were the one. We don't know if she did or didn't because Shawn spilled the beans. Or she very well could have felt day to day she was in love with 2 people in these separated relationships until the moment she had to make a choice on FRC day.

So while I think it is easier to view Kaitlyn as just playing games (which she was, imo) she was still confused, imo but that viewpoint is less popular since it takes away from the fantasy story of Love at first Sight for lead/F1 and their possible future outside this show.

I just see it as a case of trying to fit The Bette world into reality world of love/relationships and trying to reconcile the two (which, if the lead was confused is difficult to do without taking away from the lead/F1 relationship).

jmo

mindless wrote:

Lucas15 wrote:

dw_a_mom wrote:How you feel and what you think after being intimate with someone are so telling. In Kaitlyn's case, her mind went to Shawn, and what he would think. She may not have known until then just how serious her feelings were.

You know I've wrestled for a long time trying to figure out exactly why Kaitlyn had sex with Nick when she did, and the best I have ever been able to come up with is that Kaitlyn was in "dating mode". She had the show whispering in her ear that:

"this process works if you let it. You have to concentrate on who you are with and let that relationship progress as though it was the only relationship you are in. That way at the end you are able to figure out which relationship is the right one for you. Getting too focused on one relationship too soon may leave you with nothing if that person turns out not to be who you thought they were."

Now IMO this is one huge line of BS and while it sounds like it makes perfect sense to most leads, it's really how the show gets the lead to give real emotions and affection to a bunch of different people and makes for good TV. But it makes for lousy trust between the lead and anybody. But - this is what put Kaitlyn in "dating mode" and when Kaitlyn is in dating mode and she likes the person she's with and she has the opportunity, she'll have sex with them. I'm not saying I agree with her, but I think this is how she thinks and that's how she thought and it seemed a perfectly logical thing for her to do with Nick.

Until the next morning when reality hit her - and she was more sober - and as you suggest - thinking about the possible repercussions of what she had did and the effect it would have on the relationship she wanted out of the experience overshadowed any other relationship.

With all due respect, I think Kaitlyn had sex with Nick because she really really wanted to. I'm sure there had been some serious sexual tension ever since they started talking and lord knows what else, so when the opportunity presented itself to release said tension, she jumped right into it. Understandable. And I guess it was good, since she went for 2nds (and possibly 3rds).

They had already been setting each other befor the show and during one of those until 3 AM phone calls probably had some phone sex. She made out with him in NYC before even deciding to bring him on the show. Kaitlyn and Nick had spent two to three months priming themselves before the show to have sex. She wore a sweater with holes in the back to give him "easy access" during the day, her words not mine. Kaitlyn was already ready to have sex with Nick in NYC IMO and their day of pub crawling in Dublin helped that. Kaitlyn invited him to her room and her bedroom. She wanted it. The next morning she was giddy and happy until the little producer birdie said "What if he tells the other guys and they get mad?" We saw her get upset and start the crying then. Had the producer not said that, I doubt that she feels any remorse or guilt until she sees the guys that day. JMHO.

^ IA Stuck. I think if no one made Kaitlyn feel bad (Shawn included) Kaitlyn wouldn't even regret the timing. Plus, if she really felt soooo bad she never would have kept Nick to F2. She could have dumped him in Ireland. And to the idea that she wouldn't be allowed to, well, snapchat gate and Kaitlyn's blogs are reason enough for me to think she wouldn't care about what she is or isn't allowed to do.

I personally believe that if Kaitlyn didn't want to have sex with Nick she wouldn't have done it and if she didn't want to have Nick all the way to F2 she would have sent him home packing long before then. She seems like someone, during show and post show, who puts herself first and that is what I think she did with Nick, no matter what she told Shawn or Nick she was there for herself and her actions reflect that. jmo

How do we know Nick and Kaitlyn were sexting, who would tell RS? This is all so creepy to think that one or both of them told their friends intimate details who then leaked it to RS? Sometimes I can't believe how much he knows about everyone's sex life. Yuck.

I mean, it isn't very difficult to believe, I'm just amazed that RS apparently knows this.