Episode 8 - 7/18 Hometown dates - Discussion - Spoilers

Samantharose wrote:

Well imo, this just supports JP having a physical edit.[/quote]Regarding the bolded, if that's true, God Bless Ben, he's gonna need it to get over watching the 'physical edit'. It's ten times more than Emily or Robeto ever had to see, esp. when she's "pecking" her kisses to Ben, compared to these. I doubt TPTB forced her to be that intimate for the physical edit, just my opinion, we can agree to disagree about it, no problemo! :D [/quote]

She is melting back into JP in that pic. Like I said, if Ben is F1, its going to take alot more than a journal to explain what was going on with those 2. :giggle: [/quote]

And the way she has her hands on his arm it seems she is pulling him even closer. Yet we are to believe he is the aggressor and not her. Sorry, not buying it. Thing about it is he is getting the physical edit, but he is getting an emotional edit as well.

GrahamGal wrote:

Samantharose wrote:

Well imo, this just supports JP having a physical edit.

Regarding the bolded, if that's true, God Bless Ben, he's gonna need it to get over watching the 'physical edit'. It's ten times more than Emily or Robeto ever had to see, esp. when she's "pecking" her kisses to Ben, compared to these. I doubt TPTB forced her to be that intimate for the physical edit, just my opinion, we can agree to disagree about it, no problemo! :D [/quote]

She is melting back into JP in that pic. Like I said, if Ben is F1, its going to take alot more than a journal to explain what was going on with those 2. :giggle: [/quote]

And the way she has her hands on his arm it seems she is pulling him even closer. Yet we are to believe he is the aggressor and not her. Sorry, not buying it. Thing about it is he is getting the physical edit, but he is getting an emotional edit as well.[/quote]

ironcat wrote:Is the fact that two years in a row, the toast order matched the finish order of the F3, a deliberate move by producers (and I still would love for one person to give a logical reason WHY they would purposely do this), or is it just a coincidence? There are a lot of coincidences that happen twice or even three times. Five or six times in a row? Maybe not a coincidence. IMO.

Post-show on the boards is where the "It Happens EVERY Season" will play out. F1 supporters will be very happy, say they saw it from day one, it was all meant to be, and they will wish F2 well in his/her search for love. F2 supporters will whine that they weren't shown the love story, that F2 is better off without the lead, that F1 and lead will not make it six months, that F2 dodged a bullet, and that lead is so dumb, ugly, boring, pathetic, etc., and they are so glad F2 will not have to put up with lead for a single day. Now this you can count on--It Happens EVERY Season.

GrahamGal wrote:

Samantharose wrote:

Well imo, this just supports JP having a physical edit.

Regarding the bolded, if that's true, God Bless Ben, he's gonna need it to get over watching the 'physical edit'. It's ten times more than Emily or Robeto ever had to see, esp. when she's "pecking" her kisses to Ben, compared to these. I doubt TPTB forced her to be that intimate for the physical edit, just my opinion, we can agree to disagree about it, no problemo! :D [/quote]

She is melting back into JP in that pic. Like I said, if Ben is F1, its going to take alot more than a journal to explain what was going on with those 2. :giggle: [/quote]

And the way she has her hands on his arm it seems she is pulling him even closer. Yet we are to believe he is the aggressor and not her. Sorry, not buying it. Thing about it is he is getting the physical edit, but he is getting an emotional edit as well.[/quote]

Yep plus Ashley said he's the total package for her.

beader wrote:

ironcat wrote:Is the fact that two years in a row, the toast order matched the finish order of the F3, a deliberate move by producers (and I still would love for one person to give a logical reason WHY they would purposely do this), or is it just a coincidence? There are a lot of coincidences that happen twice or even three times. Five or six times in a row? Maybe not a coincidence. IMO.

Post-show on the boards is where the "It Happens EVERY Season" will play out. F1 supporters will be very happy, say they saw it from day one, it was all meant to be, and they will wish F2 well in his/her search for love. F2 supporters will whine that they weren't shown the love story, that F2 is better off without the lead, that F1 and lead will not make it six months, that F2 dodged a bullet, and that lead is so dumb, ugly, boring, pathetic, etc., and they are so glad F2 will not have to put up with lead for a single day. Now this you can count on--It Happens EVERY Season.

Definitely, definitely true. I have both on either side several times and I admit to my part in it. I just hope we can all remain gracious this season!

I don't understand why the physical edit for the Bachelorette series is considered a red flag. Several Bachelorettes chose their physical edit, such as Ali and Meredith, clearly, and Jill had a pretty physical connection with Ed. Probably Jen was shown most physically into Jerry as well. And in Deanna's season, neither Jason nor Jesse really had a physical edit. In fact, only Trista could probably be said to have had more of a physical edit with Charlie than with Ryan. So if anything,history shows that the physical edit is more of an indication of who the Bachelorette picks than not.

It's definitely the reverse for the Bachelor shows, with a few exceptions.

ironcat wrote:Is the fact that two years in a row, the toast order matched the finish order of the F3, a deliberate move by producers (and I still would love for one person to give a logical reason WHY they would purposely do this), or is it just a coincidence? There are a lot of coincidences that happen twice or even three times. Five or six times in a row? Maybe not a coincidence. IMO.

I am not sure I understand your question, but I will say what I think. Starting with DeAnnas' season you see the specific line up showing the order of the final four. ON the the group picture of the 25 men you see every F1 on the front row. DeAnna has Jesse C, Jeremy, and Jason on the front row with her. Jillian has Ed, Reid and Kip, Ali, Roberto and Kirk, Ashley is Jp and William.

The final four: DeAnna F1 position on right, Jillian F1 on left, Ali F1 on left, Ashley, Ben is on left and JP is on right. Maybe, this is the year for the F1 position to change.(just a thought). So the question becomes, we know they are reusing patterns, but are they reusing them exactly from year to year or are they mixing them up. Meaning, A little from each season. There are differences with each season therefore, they have to mix things up. JMO. But, if anyone would ask me based on what I have seen not using any pattern at all who is the F1, my answer would be JP. It is in the eyes, the touches, their voice, just something about the way they are with each other. But, this is a show, Ben may be the Man.....

Samantharose wrote:

Bronwyn wrote:

ironcat wrote:Is the fact that two years in a row, the toast order matched the finish order of the F3, a deliberate move by producers (and I still would love for one person to give a logical reason WHY they would purposely do this), or is it just a coincidence? There are a lot of coincidences that happen twice or even three times. Five or six times in a row? Maybe not a coincidence. IMO.

I thought that they actually changed things up every few seasons, because they caught onto people figuring out their patterns, in proving who F1 was.

I think they have interns or minions monitoring different message boards.

That made me think of something I've been wanting to say a while. RS is an obvious target for Fleiss but I think the sleuthers are getting up there as a target too. The difference is RS has a widely read site. The sleuthers don't yet have a widely read blog type site where their findings reveal definitely the F4, F3, and F2 - this message board probably gets a lot of traffic but it's not as easy a target as a blog where the conclusions are laid out definitively. Here we have discussions.

But with places like Wet Paint, it may be just a matter of time. I don't think they've been trying too hard to manipulate previews as a regular business. I do think certain things about the storyboard and RC placement do get changed around from year to year for optics but also to avoid a regular pattern. But if we get to the point where the sleuthers findings are able to lay out the season as definitively then there may be some changes in how previews are presented (I can see them hiring random people for previews and stuff like that) and also some foilers put out there.

sydney1 wrote:

ironcat wrote:Is the fact that two years in a row, the toast order matched the finish order of the F3, a deliberate move by producers (and I still would love for one person to give a logical reason WHY they would purposely do this), or is it just a coincidence? There are a lot of coincidences that happen twice or even three times. Five or six times in a row? Maybe not a coincidence. IMO.

I am not sure I understand your question, but I will say what I think. Starting with DeAnnas' season you see the specific line up showing the order of the final four. ON the the group picture of the 25 men you see every F1 on the front row. DeAnna has Jesse C, Jeremy, and Jason on the front row with her. Jillian has Ed, Reid and Kip, Ali, Roberto and Kirk, Ashley is Jp and William.

The final four: DeAnna F1 position on right, Jillian F1 on left, Ali F1 on left, Ashley, Ben is on left and JP is on right. Maybe, this is the year for the F1 position to change.(just a thought). So the question becomes, we know they are reusing patterns, but are they reusing them exactly from year to year or are they mixing them up. Meaning, A little from each season. There are differences with each season therefore, they have to mix things up. JMO. But, if anyone would ask me based on what I have seen not using any pattern at all who is the F1, my answer would be JP. It is in the eyes, the touches, their voice, just something about the way they are with each other. But, this is a show, Ben may be the Man.....

Thanks for responding. I guess what I am trying to ask is what exactly is the point or benefit, from the producers' perspective, of lining up the toast participants in a particular order that gives away the ending? Other than playing a game with sleuthers to give us clues (which to me sounds kind of ridiculous and clearly goes against all their other careful efforts to hide the ending), I don't see why they would purposely do this. IOW, why put them in any particular order in the first place, other than for esthetic reasons (ie, height, color of clothing, etc)?

mnmhughes wrote:

beader wrote:

ironcat wrote:Is the fact that two years in a row, the toast order matched the finish order of the F3, a deliberate move by producers (and I still would love for one person to give a logical reason WHY they would purposely do this), or is it just a coincidence? There are a lot of coincidences that happen twice or even three times. Five or six times in a row? Maybe not a coincidence. IMO.

Post-show on the boards is where the "It Happens EVERY Season" will play out. F1 supporters will be very happy, say they saw it from day one, it was all meant to be, and they will wish F2 well in his/her search for love. F2 supporters will whine that they weren't shown the love story, that F2 is better off without the lead, that F1 and lead will not make it six months, that F2 dodged a bullet, and that lead is so dumb, ugly, boring, pathetic, etc., and they are so glad F2 will not have to put up with lead for a single day. Now this you can count on--It Happens EVERY Season.

Definitely, definitely true. I have both on either side several times and I admit to my part in it. I just hope we can all remain gracious this season!

mnmhughes,I too have been on either side of it and I am embarassed to admit my part in it. I really hope that this time we can all remain gracious whatever the outcome might be.

allykat wrote:I'm sorry, but I'm not tracking this conversation. Is it an actual pattern that either: a) we only see the lead bring gifts to the F1 and F2 families, or b) if we see all 4 families get gifts then the most expensive ones go to F1 and F2? Or is this speculation? This is an honest question because I've never heard that before and haven't noticed it in the past...I always just assumed the producers go out that morning and buy a bottle of wine or flowers or whatever, and hand it to the lead as they get out of the car.

Here is something else to consider...JP's roller skating date occurred on Easter Sunday when the rink was closed to the general public. Unless the producers stopped at a corner gas station to pick up Easter flowers on the way to JP's house, they may have been SOL on finding someplace open on that particular day. I also wondered if the date ended early (while it was still daylight) as 1) the crew wanted to spend part of the Easter holiday with their families and/or 2) any additional footage would have been even harder to edit out the connection, so they called it a day early. Ending it early may have also added to the good tension that exists between Ashley and JP to make the heart grow even fonder on the way to the fantasy dates.

ETA: I've also wondered about the timing of the other HTD since if they were filmed in the order of Ben, Constantine, Ames, JP, if the HTDs interefered with Holy Week. Not sure about Greek Orthodox, but for Catholics and I presume other Christians, the days leading up to Easter are hardly worthly of feasting and celebration. They are generally solemn and reflective before the celebration that comes on Easter. If GO celebrates Easter at the same time as other Christians, the religious issues would seem even more prominent if a celebratory party were held on Holy Thursday or Good Friday. Just my two cents.

JPs mom sent some food with Ashley to take back to her hotel. I wonder how they kept JP from going to her hotel? Seems very tempting for them to spend some extra time together. Also, doesn't JP live in the city? I wish we could have seen his apartment.