Episode 7 - 7/11 - Discussion - Spoilers

Reidiscool wrote:Jilly was the exception to the rule!!! I seriously don't know how any of the woman leads can kiss, play out their convos in front of the cameras and about 5-6 crew, let alone snog someone who they know they are going to eliminate soon. Ash has kissed quite few this season but none with any gusto!

Kashathediva wrote:

Gina wrote:

Coastal wrote:

Gina wrote:I'd go out with JP in a heartbeat if I didn't already have a great guy. He handled it all with maturity and calmness. Addressed the issues and got rewarded with passionate kisses and a rose. Ashley has said it showed strength and sincerity :D

Sorry, but can you honestly say you didn't see the daggers that JP was shooting in Ben's direction??????????? The looks that JP was giving off ...........seriously ugly looks and that's for sure.

You should see the way I'm looking at some of these ridiculous comments. He has nothing on me. Talk about beating a dead horse on here. jeez a whiz. Looks don't hurt, but words and actions do. JP didn't hurt anyone and yes, I'd date him in a minute if I didn't have a boyfriend. I'm over this discussion, carry on

TOTALLY, totally.
My nonverbal facial expressions and hand gestures could get me locked up IF they were crimes. But they aren't. Looks--pfft.
Now if someone slashes my tires, carves their name into my leather seats or smacks me one upside the head, I would think they have anger issues.

Kashathediva wrote:

Reidiscool wrote:Jilly was the exception to the rule!!! I seriously don't know how any of the woman leads can kiss, play out their convos in front of the cameras and about 5-6 crew, let alone snog someone who they know they are going to eliminate soon. Ash has kissed quite few this season but none with any gusto!

The only heat editing has shown this season IMO is the grindfest in the tramcar. Reminds me of summer at the Jersey Shore: "don't block the tramcar, please!"

Kashathediva wrote:

Gina wrote:

Coastal wrote:

Gina wrote:I'd go out with JP in a heartbeat if I didn't already have a great guy. He handled it all with maturity and calmness. Addressed the issues and got rewarded with passionate kisses and a rose. Ashley has said it showed strength and sincerity :D

Sorry, but can you honestly say you didn't see the daggers that JP was shooting in Ben's direction??????????? The looks that JP was giving off ...........seriously ugly looks and that's for sure.

You should see the way I'm looking at some of these ridiculous comments. He has nothing on me. Talk about beating a dead horse on here. jeez a whiz. Looks don't hurt, but words and actions do. JP didn't hurt anyone and yes, I'd date him in a minute if I didn't have a boyfriend. I'm over this discussion, carry on

TOTALLY, totally.
My nonverbal facial expressions and hand gestures could get me locked up IF they were crimes. But they aren't. Looks--pfft.
Now if someone slashes my tires, carves their name into my leather seats or smacks me one upside the head, I would think they have anger issues.

sjcaligurl wrote:

Kashathediva wrote:

Reidiscool wrote:Jilly was the exception to the rule!!! I seriously don't know how any of the woman leads can kiss, play out their convos in front of the cameras and about 5-6 crew, let alone snog someone who they know they are going to eliminate soon. Ash has kissed quite few this season but none with any gusto!

The only heat editing has shown this season IMO is the grindfest in the tramcar. Reminds me of summer at the Jersey Shore: "don't block the tramcar, please!"

I don't know, I thought something might go down in the rain on the beach in Thailand. Mouths looked open to me! LOL! Ryan made his vlog after that episode and he looked shell shocked even though his topic was the other guys trashing him.

Kelad9 wrote:

sjcaligurl wrote:

Kashathediva wrote:

Reidiscool wrote:Jilly was the exception to the rule!!! I seriously don't know how any of the woman leads can kiss, play out their convos in front of the cameras and about 5-6 crew, let alone snog someone who they know they are going to eliminate soon. Ash has kissed quite few this season but none with any gusto!

The only heat editing has shown this season IMO is the grindfest in the tramcar. Reminds me of summer at the Jersey Shore: "don't block the tramcar, please!"

I don't know, I thought something might go down in the rain on the beach in Thailand. Mouths looked open to me! LOL! Ryan made his vlog after that episode and he looked shell shocked even though his topic was the other guys trashing him.

Maybe he wasn't shell shocked that she dumped him but shocked over what the other guys were saying about him in PI's? Maybe he thought they didn't have any problems.... *shrugs*

Gina wrote:

Kashathediva wrote:

Gina wrote:

Coastal wrote:

Gina wrote:I'd go out with JP in a heartbeat if I didn't already have a great guy. He handled it all with maturity and calmness. Addressed the issues and got rewarded with passionate kisses and a rose. Ashley has said it showed strength and sincerity :D

Sorry, but can you honestly say you didn't see the daggers that JP was shooting in Ben's direction??????????? The looks that JP was giving off ...........seriously ugly looks and that's for sure.

You should see the way I'm looking at some of these ridiculous comments. He has nothing on me. Talk about beating a dead horse on here. jeez a whiz. Looks don't hurt, but words and actions do. JP didn't hurt anyone and yes, I'd date him in a minute if I didn't have a boyfriend. I'm over this discussion, carry on

TOTALLY, totally.
My nonverbal facial expressions and hand gestures could get me locked up IF they were crimes. But they aren't. Looks--pfft.
Now if someone slashes my tires, carves their name into my leather seats or smacks me one upside the head, I would think they have anger issues.

Kasha, . You should see the 'daggers' I give my younger sister when she 'borrows' my best heels and 'forgets' to return them. JP looks like a baby compared to my 'daggers' to my sis. But I love her and would do anything for her.

ETA..."grindfest" perfact description. :giggle:

sjcaligurl wrote:

Coastal wrote:

ninu wrote:Feedback from completely unspoiled - my mom and sister think that Ash is only "going through the motions for the money" and that she's still totally into Bentley still... that's who she fell for and isn't into any of the others.

And my sister said "he looks like a serial killer" during a closeup on JP's face during Lucas/Ash kissing

LOL, I can agree with that, now include the dagger look that JP was giving Ben when Ben returned from his date.........yowsi!!

Oh stop! LOL! I didn't see any dagger shots at Ben. Even if he did have a 'cross' look on his face, we don't know at what point in the day/moment it was. It's not like Ben hadn't taken great fun in teasing JP because he knew it bothered him when other guys were around her. None of the guys were really happy/comfortable on that date. Lucas did his fair share of complaining. Ames' expression didn't look that happy. He and Lucas were having quite the yuckfest at JP's expense. It wasn't the fun date she'd thought it would be and they were all looking forward to their alone time. Lucas took time to complain about his 'dress' as though it violated his manhood. We don't know what Ames talked about outside of his baby pics. JP used his time wisely to be honest about the fact that he had been having a hard time all week watching the guys go on dates with her and Ben not coming home. He admitted that he wasn't handling it as well as he had been because his feelings had gotten to deep. He admitted to being in a bad mood for the past 2 days, not wanting to talk and not wanting to hear anything.

Each of the guys acted out in their own way i think. In fact, people were assuming Lucas was the one who got jealous because of his angry response to the Bentley news. I really like Ben and JP a lot but this is about Ashley's journey and it appears to me that she's always had a stronger connection to JP than anyone else - including Bentley. I'm trying to go by what her heart appears to want. JP handled his 'jealousy' far better than, say, Graham did on DeAnna's season where he chose to withhold affection/kissing instead of honestly telling her that he was having a hard time dealing with her dating/kissing other guys. Frank shut down/hung back from Ali after his first date when she had to go out with other guys. Ryan Sutter was losing it on Trista's season and he freaked out again during the wedding special and took off by himself and Trista ended up wandering around crying looking for him. He seems to have turned out to be a very good husband and dad.

Yes, JP started to freak out but he laid back, closed his eyes and tried not to think about it or get engaged with the guys who were egging him on. He told Constantine, you aren't getting anything out of me. I'm sure it did bother him when Ben came back and he probably couldn't stand looking at him because he'd start wondering if/how he touched Ashley in the same way that he had. BUT, the very first minute he could, he poured it all out with honesty and vulnerability. It paid off because she knew exactly how he felt.

Ben and Ames actually had it right. If the guys are really invested in Ashley, as Ben said, "you have me where you want me" and as Ames said "this is completely out of our control." JP knows it too but he's comfortable enough with her to tell her how he feels about it and she appreciates that.

The MTA should be quite interesting as the guys will have seen all but the finale by then. I'll bet some of them will even evaluate how they've been handling their relationships after seeing how the guys who got to the end handle theirs. I think Ben would make a sweet, sensitive, attentive husband and nurturing father. I think JP will make a fiercely protective partner and playful dad.

Wes Hayden tweeted some macho BS about the guys on the show needing to "grow some sack" yet he seems to have no luck finding anyone decent. David Good has a whole lot of dribble about being a man yet I doubt he's ever had a real girlfriend/good relationship either. Maybe they both need to take some notes from the guys Wes deems 'neutered.'

Nativenewyorker wrote:

Coastal wrote:

Nativenewyorker wrote:

Coastal wrote:

Nativenewyorker wrote:

Coastal wrote:

sjcaligurl wrote:

Coastal wrote:

mnmhughes wrote:

northernviewer wrote:JP seems to be the only one really interested in Ashley the person. I bet if Ben and Dino were given the choice of having a 1/1 with Ashley or each other, they'd pick each other. Yep, a real life Lloyd and Harry on a moped, truckin' up the mountain....... hope Dino doesn't have to pee.....

I agree. I think TPTB left JP's jealousy in the edit because, frankly, none of the other guys care and this episode would have been even more boring than it already was. JMO. :hidingchair

I disagree extently............it is extremely obvious that Ben cares for her greatly!! If you have an open mind, it would be extremely obvious. IMO

I think the remaining guys care about her a lot at the level they are at with her. i would place Ames above Constantine but it seems Ames will go first. Ben is definitely falling for her. He's just so sweet. She's got two very sweet, but different, guys at the top. The finale is going to be tough to watch.

It seems to me that depending on what side of the fence you stand, the more likely that not all facts or all realistic things into consideration..........meaning, I believe the guys care greatly for her.........the only one I see handling the situation extremely badly is JP.

Respectfully, I do not agree with this statement. I basically posted my feelings last night at length as to why I think JP handled it the way he did. I didn't judge him, merely explained why I understood how he was feeling and what was going on inside him.

I don't know that I want to restate my comments once more. However, I believe that JP was being real, being himself, struggling like human beings do when they are in a situation which has become extremely difficult for them.

And please, before I am called out for being a JP worshipper and not a Ben fan, I will point out that I have had only good things to say about Ben. JP has been my favorite from the beginning, but I have come to like and admire Ben. He is funny, smart, charming and has a kind of laid back, chill disposition. Although I do think that he has strong emotions underneath that relaxed exterior. I think he's a great guy.

I connect more with JP, see some of myself when I was much younger in him, had this kind of gut feeling or instinct about him immediately. It's not a contest with me. These are two terrific guys and whoever Ashley picks, she will be very lucky.

I am not a Ben fan either..........I just see their connection just as I see a connection betwen Ash and Constantine/Ames as well. The only difference is I am remaining neutral and therefore can see different things and don't go gaga over JP.......that seems to be a bit of a plague on here lately. IMO

I haven't posted since some time in the wee hours of yesterday morning. I was kind of uncomfortable with the comments about the JP fans, how we are in the majority and making others feel uncomfortable. I also didn't want to read any more comments about JP's behavior in this latest episode. I said what I thought and that was it. JP was attacked weeks ago for being supposedly controlling and possessive. I expressed my feelings about that at the time. I am really not of a mind to defend JP endlessly. I read some comments on another forum that were quite unfortunate and harsh about JP. So then I decided I was done.

I must have missed what happened today, or I guess it would now be yesterday. I haven't caught up on all of the discussion here. What I will say is that when I was sent a pm on FORT inviting me to join this site, I had no way of knowing that people here would like JP the way I did. I have been in the minority in the past. Sometimes that meant not posting very much on FORT, when things got really heated.

I do still think it's JP, however I am keeping an open mind. I have been trying to keep up with all of the latest information. I have not ruled out the possibility that it could be Ben. I know this show too well. Since I like both JP and Ben, there will be no conflict or histrionic reaction from me. I will be happy for whoever Ashley picks and wish them the best. I also know that whoever is F2, will also be fine.

I am just feeling a bit unnerved by the comments about how JP fans are making it difficult for some people here. I have spoken a good deal about what I think about JP, how I feel and why I really like him. Hopefully, that has not been a part of what is making people feel unwelcome or unheard.

For me, it boiled down to what happened today/yesterday, whatever the heck it was.........I was called names for saying things against JP...........that, I didn't take too kindly to. You, yourself have shown compassion for all sides from what I see. There are others that haven't and those are the ones that I am talking about with regards to feeling completely uncomfortable around. Hope you can understand that. I have voiced how I feel about JP and his temperment and attitude with Monday's show........That feeling I have won't change. I am not on anyone's side as I am seriously trying to remain neutral considering what I know. That's all I can say for now.

For what it's worth, I do more lurking and reading than posting. I have read everything you have said, along with others who have information about Ben being F1. I take it all in and then keep it in the back of my mind. So I am paying attention.

To be honest, I have been going back and forth with all of this. In my heart, I still think it's JP. Having said that, there are times when I read information and begin to wonder. I just never feel entirely comfortable and sure with this show, unless the sleuthers here manage to uncover solid, substantive proof as to the identity of the F1. They did it right near the end of Ali's season with the reveal that it was Roberto. He was my favorite and also someone I liked from the very beginning. However, I read the back and forth on FORT and still questioned if I was right that it was Roberto. I do kind of test myself as I go along. I try to decide if I am thinking and feeling what I am because it's what I want to happen or what I know.

I do believe that you are entitled to think what you will about JP's behavior. I can respect your right to do that completely. It seems that I am always battling my rational side versus my emotional side. So it can get a little crazy. There are days when I wake up and know it's JP for sure, Then there are days when I wake up and think that it might be Ben. I haven't really spoken about this process that I go through up until now. No matter what, JP has won my heart. He is special to me. I would love what I am feeling to become reality, but if it doesn't, then the sun will still rise and set the next day and life will go on.

Pattycake92 wrote:Well, the guys can usually tell who the bachelorette likes the most very early on. It's no different this season. She has a great f2 who both seem crazy about her so who really cares about the others?

Coastal wrote:

Nativenewyorker wrote:

Coastal wrote:

Nativenewyorker wrote:

Coastal wrote:

Nativenewyorker wrote:

Coastal wrote:

sjcaligurl wrote:

Coastal wrote:

mnmhughes wrote:

northernviewer wrote:JP seems to be the only one really interested in Ashley the person. I bet if Ben and Dino were given the choice of having a 1/1 with Ashley or each other, they'd pick each other. Yep, a real life Lloyd and Harry on a moped, truckin' up the mountain....... hope Dino doesn't have to pee.....

I agree. I think TPTB left JP's jealousy in the edit because, frankly, none of the other guys care and this episode would have been even more boring than it already was. JMO. :hidingchair

I disagree extently............it is extremely obvious that Ben cares for her greatly!! If you have an open mind, it would be extremely obvious. IMO

I think the remaining guys care about her a lot at the level they are at with her. i would place Ames above Constantine but it seems Ames will go first. Ben is definitely falling for her. He's just so sweet. She's got two very sweet, but different, guys at the top. The finale is going to be tough to watch.

It seems to me that depending on what side of the fence you stand, the more likely that not all facts or all realistic things into consideration..........meaning, I believe the guys care greatly for her.........the only one I see handling the situation extremely badly is JP.

Respectfully, I do not agree with this statement. I basically posted my feelings last night at length as to why I think JP handled it the way he did. I didn't judge him, merely explained why I understood how he was feeling and what was going on inside him.

I don't know that I want to restate my comments once more. However, I believe that JP was being real, being himself, struggling like human beings do when they are in a situation which has become extremely difficult for them.

And please, before I am called out for being a JP worshipper and not a Ben fan, I will point out that I have had only good things to say about Ben. JP has been my favorite from the beginning, but I have come to like and admire Ben. He is funny, smart, charming and has a kind of laid back, chill disposition. Although I do think that he has strong emotions underneath that relaxed exterior. I think he's a great guy.

I connect more with JP, see some of myself when I was much younger in him, had this kind of gut feeling or instinct about him immediately. It's not a contest with me. These are two terrific guys and whoever Ashley picks, she will be very lucky.

I am not a Ben fan either..........I just see their connection just as I see a connection betwen Ash and Constantine/Ames as well. The only difference is I am remaining neutral and therefore can see different things and don't go gaga over JP.......that seems to be a bit of a plague on here lately. IMO

I haven't posted since some time in the wee hours of yesterday morning. I was kind of uncomfortable with the comments about the JP fans, how we are in the majority and making others feel uncomfortable. I also didn't want to read any more comments about JP's behavior in this latest episode. I said what I thought and that was it. JP was attacked weeks ago for being supposedly controlling and possessive. I expressed my feelings about that at the time. I am really not of a mind to defend JP endlessly. I read some comments on another forum that were quite unfortunate and harsh about JP. So then I decided I was done.

I must have missed what happened today, or I guess it would now be yesterday. I haven't caught up on all of the discussion here. What I will say is that when I was sent a pm on FORT inviting me to join this site, I had no way of knowing that people here would like JP the way I did. I have been in the minority in the past. Sometimes that meant not posting very much on FORT, when things got really heated.

I do still think it's JP, however I am keeping an open mind. I have been trying to keep up with all of the latest information. I have not ruled out the possibility that it could be Ben. I know this show too well. Since I like both JP and Ben, there will be no conflict or histrionic reaction from me. I will be happy for whoever Ashley picks and wish them the best. I also know that whoever is F2, will also be fine.

I am just feeling a bit unnerved by the comments about how JP fans are making it difficult for some people here. I have spoken a good deal about what I think about JP, how I feel and why I really like him. Hopefully, that has not been a part of what is making people feel unwelcome or unheard.

For me, it boiled down to what happened today/yesterday, whatever the heck it was.........I was called names for saying things against JP...........that, I didn't take too kindly to. You, yourself have shown compassion for all sides from what I see. There are others that haven't and those are the ones that I am talking about with regards to feeling completely uncomfortable around. Hope you can understand that. I have voiced how I feel about JP and his temperment and attitude with Monday's show........That feeling I have won't change. I am not on anyone's side as I am seriously trying to remain neutral considering what I know. That's all I can say for now.

For what it's worth, I do more lurking and reading than posting. I have read everything you have said, along with others who have information about Ben being F1. I take it all in and then keep it in the back of my mind. So I am paying attention.

To be honest, I have been going back and forth with all of this. In my heart, I still think it's JP. Having said that, there are times when I read information and begin to wonder. I just never feel entirely comfortable and sure with this show, unless the sleuthers here manage to uncover solid, substantive proof as to the identity of the F1. They did it right near the end of Ali's season with the reveal that it was Roberto. He was my favorite and also someone I liked from the very beginning. However, I read the back and forth on FORT and still questioned if I was right that it was Roberto. I do kind of test myself as I go along. I try to decide if I am thinking and feeling what I am because it's what I want to happen or what I know.

I do believe that you are entitled to think what you will about JP's behavior. I can respect your right to do that completely. It seems that I am always battling my rational side versus my emotional side. So it can get a little crazy. There are days when I wake up and know it's JP for sure, Then there are days when I wake up and think that it might be Ben. I haven't really spoken about this process that I go through up until now. No matter what, JP has won my heart. He is special to me. I would love what I am feeling to become reality, but if it doesn't, then the sun will still rise and set the next day and life will go on.

Again, thanks for your post.........full of reasoning and at least compassion with regards to respect for how I feel about JP and his attitude from Monday's show. Again, if it was the first time it happened with the guys, that 's different, but according to Ames, Lucas, and Ryan........it's nothing new and it seemed that it frustrated the guys a lot.

Look forward to more of your posts........