Re: Nick Viall - Bachelorette 10 - Discussion - Thread #7

[Lucas15]

I'm curious if the Nick fans have ever really tried see things from Andi's standpoint?

I hope that's mostly a rhetorical question as it seems from post after post in this forum (and I'll include just about all of mine as well) that most people try to defend Nick by criticizing Andi and defend Andi by criticizing Nick. Neither is perfect and both have made mistakes but mistakes made by one don't excuse or mitigate mistakes made by the other. Maybe someday we'll be able to discuss the mistakes Nick has made without trying to defend him by pointing out the mistakes Andi has made and vice verse, but I don't think that day is here yet.

[emad0722]

I'm curious if the Nick fans have ever really tried see things from Andi's standpoint?

I hope that's mostly a rhetorical question as it seems from post after post in this forum (and I'll include just about all of mine as well) that most people try to defend Nick by criticizing Andi and defend Andi by criticizing Nick. Neither is perfect and both have made mistakes but mistakes made by one don't excuse or mitigate mistakes made by the other. Maybe someday we'll be able to discuss the mistakes Nick has made without trying to defend him by pointing out the mistakes Andi has made and vice verse, but I don't think that day is here yet.

let's be honest most nick fans see they both have made mistakes, wish both had done things differently and compassion had been shown on both sides. Personally I still fall on the nick side but I do see it was hard for Andi. No one really thinks she should have made a different decision just that her demeanor could have been more caring to Nicks feelings. I think the hardest thing for Andi is Nick really pushed her with hard questions and her response was to be cold. I also believe her coldness pushed nick too far also. No one is perfect in this situation but most nick fans have moved on and just want him to he happy. Equally most wish Andi and Josh the best too. I just hope both took away lessons from this experience.

[Cari]

I'm curious if the Nick fans have ever really tried see things from Andi's standpoint?

I hope that's mostly a rhetorical question as it seems from post after post in this forum (and I'll include just about all of mine as well) that most people try to defend Nick by criticizing Andi and defend Andi by criticizing Nick. Neither is perfect and both have made mistakes but mistakes made by one don't excuse or mitigate mistakes made by the other. Maybe someday we'll be able to discuss the mistakes Nick has made without trying to defend him by pointing out the mistakes Andi has made and vice verse, but I don't think that day is here yet.

let's be honest most nick fans see they both have made mistakes, wish both had done things differently and compassion had been shown on both sides. Personally I still fall on the nick side but I do see it was hard for Andi. No one really thinks she should have made a different decision just that her demeanor could have been more caring to Nicks feelings. I think the hardest thing for Andi is Nick really pushed her with hard questions and her response was to be cold. I also believe her coldness pushed nick too far also. No one is perfect in this situation but most nick fans have moved on and just want him to he happy. Equally most wish Andi and Josh the best too. I just hope both took away lessons from this experience.

 :WAVEY:  emad, I always love your post!   

Sir Lucas & Launder!   

#goingbacktolurkdominthisthread

[Guest]

I'm curious if the Nick fans have ever really tried see things from Andi's standpoint?

I hope that's mostly a rhetorical question as it seems from post after post in this forum (and I'll include just about all of mine as well) that most people try to defend Nick by criticizing Andi and defend Andi by criticizing Nick. Neither is perfect and both have made mistakes but mistakes made by one don't excuse or mitigate mistakes made by the other. Maybe someday we'll be able to discuss the mistakes Nick has made without trying to defend him by pointing out the mistakes Andi has made and vice verse, but I don't think that day is here yet.

let's be honest most nick fans see they both have made mistakes, wish both had done things differently and compassion had been shown on both sides. Personally I still fall on the nick side but I do see it was hard for Andi. No one really thinks she should have made a different decision just that her demeanor could have been more caring to Nicks feelings. I think the hardest thing for Andi is Nick really pushed her with hard questions and her response was to be cold. I also believe her coldness pushed nick too far also. No one is perfect in this situation but most nick fans have moved on and just want him to he happy. Equally most wish Andi and Josh the best too. I just hope both took away lessons from this experience.

This may be one of the most on point responses I have read. Great perspective. If all the fans could think this reasonably there would be a lot less ugliness on this forum. I have mostly remained in the Josh and Andi fan forum where things have been pretty positive and respectful, but I was getting tired of what I felt was one sided bashing of Andi and Josh in some other discussions. Thank you for proving that there are Nick fans that see the big picture. This situation was a tough one for Nick, Andi and Josh, but I really do wish the best for all three.

[mindless]

I find it funny that those of you who dislike "meandi"  love to listen to all her interviews

Well I always follow the couples from this franchise to some extent, since I've already wasted so many hours on their "love story" by watching the show. Can't help but be curious about how it all continues IRL. Rarely do I actually like the lead during the show, so it's interesting to see how they present themselves afterwards. And I actually don't mind Josh, even though he's far from my type. He seems like a good guy and I get that he's just protecting his "baby". Then again, he said himself he didn't watch her dates with the other guys and he probably hasn't watched the discussion Andi and Nick had on ATFR either, so he really only has one side of the story and his own experiences with Nick to go by. That's why I don't even expect him to have any sympathy or understanding towards Nick. It's Andi who I think should show that class she claimed Nick was lacking, instead of holding onto a grudge several weeks later and still taking potshots. She wasn't even presented with the question yet she had to chime in. Well at least we know one person who liked Kelly's hashtag.

[happygolucky]

I need to chip in again ... to give you a challenge ...

near the PM icon under our avatars, there's another icon that if you click on it, you can read all of our posts ...

well, I dare anyone to read all of mine and tell me when did I criticize Andi?

I do understand that criticizing her or anyone else would speak loudly and more about me.

I entered "Andi's discussion thread" and "Andi's fan thread" (not "Andi & Josh" ... because the couple wasn't ever in my interest) during the season, where despite the fact that I clearly state today "I don't like her" I left one or two positive messages of my thoughts about Andi, The Bachelorette ... and I don't retract those words, I meant them and still do.

I don't like Andi for two main reason (the rest don't matter to anyone):
- she isn't a good player (already written in one of my posts) IMO, because the good player also knows how to conclude the game with all the participants in the best way possible to exit as a winner.
- I've never seen her apologize for anything, ever. (not to Nick, not to many other guys involved in this game ... but I do ask to prove me wrong and tell me when ...if she did)

That's not a criticism ... that's a fact.
Criticizing her would mean that I have any intention for her to change, wanting her to be different (to please my ideal of a person I would like to be friends with) ... and NO,
she doesn't need to change or please anyone, especially not me, because I simply don't care for her.

So yes, I don't blame Nick, I don't criticize Nick, I can actually justify his actions, I can see his point of view, understand him and explain his actions and words and even tho' he is not saint (I don't think any Nick's fan ever claimed that he is) he isn't a person I feel any need to condemn.

[Lucas15]

I think the hardest thing for Andi is Nick really pushed her with hard questions and her response was to be cold. I also believe her coldness pushed nick too far also.

But here's a bit of irony about Andi's coldness because it was just that which provided closure for Nick. Nick said:

When she came out it was like an emotionally charged environment. I had just got done watching the finale like everyone else. I was a little taken back by her demeanor ... was a little cold. There seemed to be a complete lack of empathy and I think I was so taken back by that.

But then he also said:

"I think Monday night was a lot of closure for me, that I needed. Not necessarily about the question but her whole demeanor and the process…I was just a little taken back by that," he explained.

As Nick evidenced his feelings in his letter to Andi "if by some miracle you changed your mind and were willing to give us a shot" I think he held on to some hope that sometime along the line Andi would feel she had made a mistake in choosing Josh and that would create an opportunity for them to re-unite. I really do feel sorry for Nick; it was obvious when I saw him literally shaking at the ATFR that he was experiencing strong emotions and that had to be a very disturbing way to have his hopes dashed. But until he finally could come to grips with the finality of the "break-up" there's no way he could move forward with his future, he was stuck (emotionally) in his past. There probably was a better way to have given Nick closure but I don't know if there was any easy way to do it and Andi was the only one who could give Nick closure.

[Alanna]

I find it funny that those of you who dislike "meandi"  love to listen to all her interviews

Well I always follow the couples from this franchise to some extent, since I've already wasted so many hours on their "love story" by watching the show. Can't help but be curious about how it all continues IRL. Rarely do I actually like the lead during the show, so it's interesting to see how they present themselves afterwards. And I actually don't mind Josh, even though he's far from my type. He seems like a good guy and I get that he's just protecting his "baby". Then again, he said himself he didn't watch her dates with the other guys and he probably hasn't watched the discussion Andi and Nick had on ATFR either, so he really only has one side of the story and his own experiences with Nick to go by. That's why I don't even expect him to have any sympathy or understanding towards Nick. It's Andi who I think should show that class she claimed Nick was lacking, instead of holding onto a grudge several weeks later and still taking potshots. She wasn't even presented with the question yet she had to chime in. Well at least we know one person who liked Kelly's hashtag.  

Regarding the bolded, I think it's pretty ironic that Josh really hasn't done anything in terms of causing any problems with Nick during the show or any sm against Nick after the show, but I think the whole reason the Andi/Nick and their lead/f2 relationship is so bad is because of him. IMO, if Nick didn't start with the video on the plane with all the stuff about Josh, then the sm posting pics of himself with Andi, followed by the letter saying Josh isn't right for her, trying to see her knowing she's with Josh, and the deleted scenes where Nick and Andi are having a pup named Murray, Andi wouldn't have been so cold to Nick at atfr, he probably wouldn't have felt the need to punish her with the fs talk, and their relationship would be cordial. Josh really has been a silent participant here though

[SueSt]

Radio host: So Josh, who's the biggest douche on the show?
Josh: I think you know who that is. I don't even say that name.
Andi: Does it rhyme with the body part?


Classy as ever.

The douchiest guy was named Mulva?    (Seinfeld throwback)

IMO, anyone can make a mistake and say something mean in the heat of the moment.  But when a person makes a habit out of saying mean things and we see a pattern, that just proves that the person is mean-spirited.

Nick dodged one great big giant bullet.  No, he dodged a torpedo.    

  Totally agree with your assessment MiaHawk.
A mean-spirited person by any other name would still smell as sour!
Ugly is as ugly does!!

[SueSt]

If Andi wanted to keep her sex life a big secret, she shouldn't have had sex on a national TV show--filmed or not--the insinuation was there.  I mean really...  If women want to be free to "experience their sexuality" or whatever they want to call it, they need to be prepared to be called on it.  Her bitchiness is really showing!

Yep, Nick dodged a torpedo--thanks Mia for this description.  

I wish Andi and Josh would just go to their sweet little southern corner and enjoy their life.  They are certainly not being good representatives of the Christian faith they claim to follow.  

Totally my opinion.  

Amen to that Beader!  

[SueSt]

I understand what people are saying about Nick taking the high road after the ATFR debacle, I just don't buy it, personally. He needed to save face and he is saying and doing the right things now, but that doesn't excuse his behavior during filming and immediately after.
I'm curious if the Nick fans have ever really tried see things from Andi's standpoint? She admitted she cared about Nick, and that he was definitely her #2, but that her feelings were stronger for Josh.  Post filming, she saw for the first time some very unbecoming qualities about Nick with his snarky ITM's and interactions with some of the guys while the season played out on TV. Not to mention how he single handedly ruined any chance for a surprise ending by confirming RS"s spoilers with the plane videos all while bashing Josh as well as Andi. And then there was the deleted scene about "predicting Josh's future" where he mocked Josh again. Have you all forgotten he did and said these things? Nick was not the person Andi thought he was and she was likely very repulsed by some of his cockiness while watching the season back. Now throw in that he tries to see her post filming to "let her know how he is feeling" when he clearly states his goal is for her to change her mind since he doesn't "think Josh is a good fit for her". This was very disrespectful of both Josh and Andi and their relationship. He may have needed clarity or closure , but it appeared his goal was to break them up. I would probably appear fairly cold toward a guy who did this as well. I thought all things considered, Andi handled it with a great deal of class.

Has Andi attempted to see things from Nick's point of view? From JPab's? Doesn't look like it.

If her rudeness had been only once with Nick, I may have given her some slack, but she has shown a pattern of behaviour starting with JPab and then Eric and finally Nick...where she is rude if things don't go her way. The continuation of favouring negative tweets about Nick post show and now this most recent interview just continues to showcase her pattern of bitchiness. IMO If she is so happy, then concentrate on that. Tell people that is all in the past and we have moved on. By repeatedly taking digs at Nick, she is just showing how much it is all getting to her. Unfortunately for Andi and her great love, the Nick show has over shadowed them.

As for Nick, I am sure that he has also awakened to the reality of the real Andi and also seen a few things he may not admire. Regarding the post show stuff, like much of this show, I am sure was well orchestrated and encouraged by the producers. Like you said, at least Nick is trying now. Can't say the same for Andi.

Great post Sprite!     

[SueSt]

So yes, I don't blame Nick, I don't criticize Nick, I can actually justify his actions, I can see his point of view, understand him and explain his actions and words and even tho' he is not saint (I don't think any Nick's fan ever claimed that he is) he isn't a person I feel any need to condemn.

   

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