Re: Nick Viall - Bachelorette 10 - Discussion - Thread #7

[isittrue]

I liked Nick. I like him even more after the show. Half way through the show, I didn't want Andi to pick him because I didn't like her that much, and didn't think they were good fits.  I was one of the  Free Nick fans, along with stuck. However, that didn't mean I didn't enjoy watching them together on my TV, I had fun with other Nick Chicks, working to discover pro Nick clues through editing and SM. I was hoping for the best but preparing for the worst. So, I wasn't too surprised Josh was f1. In fact, I'd expected him to be f1. The biggest clue for me was his mom throwing the finale viewing party. So, to me, yes, Josh's family gave away the outcome; this is only my opinion and my opinion only.
So, my fav was not picked. I've never picked a winner. But, the fun for me is the process, the time I spent here discussing, speculating, and sleuthing with some wonderful posters. I know I will follow Nick for a while, then, if he stays off spotlight, my interest in him will gradually wean off. I will pick another fav, and the cycle will start again. Hopefully, one day, I will pick a F1. If not, hey, I will still have fun on this board.

sdmom. ... I have to agree w your comment on the Murray family SM.   While I thought Nick's video could go either way, it was their constant tweets revealing Josh f1 that I couldn't reconcile in my mind. So while I hoped for aNick F1 ending, I was not at all surprised w Josh F1.  Although, I so hoped Mura and Team Nick were right!    Post show, seeing more of Nick, I think her princess behavior would've driven him crazy. It is honestly not a slam against Andi, but it just seems to be who she is at this point. But the good part about that is Josh doesn't seem to mind.

I think Nick and Andi's over thinking everything would have driven both of them crazy. Everything works out for a reason.  Except for the tweet to Hy about hoping to meet his daughter I thought the Murrays stayed fairly quiet.  What Josh's mother put on FB just showed a proud mother which was no different than many other past contestants including Shay (Sean's sister).

With all due respect, I would have to disagree about Mrs. Murray staying silent on SM. Even Josh fans were proclaiming their glee for all the clues that she provided during the season. Even her quote about one of her sons possibly getting engaged on the day of FRC was very obvious. I am sure she is a proud mom but I think her SM let many of us know under no certain terms that her son was the winner. And we know that no one would book a finale viewing party if her son was left broken-hearted at the FRC.

[Ash2214]

sdmom. ... I have to agree w your comment on the Murray family SM.   While I thought Nick's video could go either way, it was their constant tweets revealing Josh f1 that I couldn't reconcile in my mind. So while I hoped for aNick F1 ending, I was not at all surprised w Josh F1.  Although, I so hoped Mura and Team Nick were right!    Post show, seeing more of Nick, I think her princess behavior would've driven him crazy. It is honestly not a slam against Andi, but it just seems to be who she is at this point. But the good part about that is Josh doesn't seem to mind.

I think Nick and Andi's over thinking everything would have driven both of them crazy. Everything works out for a reason.  Except for the tweet to Hy about hoping to meet his daughter I thought the Murrays stayed fairly quiet.  What Josh's mother put on FB just showed a proud mother which was no different than many other past contestants including Shay (Sean's sister).

With all due respect, I would have to disagree about Mrs. Murray staying silent on SM.  Even Josh fans were proclaiming their glee for all the clues that she provided during the season.  Even her quote about one of her sons possibly getting engaged on the day of FRC was very obvious.  I am sure she is a proud mom but I think her SM let many of us know under no certain terms that her son was the winner.  And we know that no one would book a finale viewing party if her son was left broken-hearted at the FRC.  

In regards to Lauren Murray, she gave us some clues on SM while the season was still filming. We also were told here that he was in the F3 at least, so it shouldn't have come too much of a shock. Afterwards, there really wasn't much. After the first couple of episodes, there was nothing on her Facebook page really other than cheering on Josh, which a lot of family members did during the season. For example, two of Nick's brothers would live tweet the episode and occasionally there would be a tweet or two that would catch my eye where I wanted to know what they were alluding to. The only big one that Lauren Murray gave us while the season was airing would be the fact that she was hosting a charity event during the finale. Although, even with that, a good amount of people people here were confident that it meant nothing and it didn't necessarily show that Josh was the F1. I remember a lot of people here said that it could just be because Lauren wanted to show him off as the next bachelor or that although her son was heartbroken he was doing fine now.

Even with the copious amount of clues we had that pointed to Josh as the F1, which came from many people and through other forms of sleuthing, people still wouldn't believe that Josh was the F1. It just goes to show that even with spoilers and clues, the thoughts surrounding them are really all about the person reading them and their thought processes around them. For one person, something could mean one thing and then another thing for someone else.

[jlccaz]

There has rarely been a season with more accumulated, diverse evidence of F1 identity, and yet the fan-base or the contrarians held out for another outcome.  It's laughable really -- Nick was "caught on tape" and that wasn't good enough.  

Also, I completely concur that Josh/family took way too much grief for "leaking" the ending, as compared to others in this or other seasons.   The F2 was in a public airport / airplane flight speaking loudly, for many minutes, about "after the final rose", the names, and all sorts of contractually protected data ... and Lauren Murray somehow ruined the season with some ambiguous posts/tweets supportive of her son?

The show / powers that be have new rules, different tolerances, for social media buzz and chatter related to show contestants during airing than they used to back when the clauses told the girls to delete or deactivate their MySpace accounts!  These contestants -- except for Nick (see above!) -- are largely playing by these new rules.  They accumulate followers/friends over the course of the show airing, and help with word of mouth marketing of the brand and individual episodes.  And sometimes, their posts cross the line of being like clues for the diehards, especially sleuthing boardie types.

Finally, US Weekly (which mostly has the facts straight over the years) and Life & Style basically also spoiled the season a few weeks out, by writing stories that left out the names Josh and Nick but otherwise completely spilled the beans.   The tabloids spilled the season as they almost always do.

Wishful or contrarian thinking abounds season after season among the show-obsessed boardies.  That will never change.  People just disregard whatever they don't want to believe.

[sdmom]

For one person, something could mean one thing and then another thing for someone else.  

I never intended to start a debate about who's responsible for spoiling this season, so that's why I stated in my original post "it's my opinion and my opinion only".
ITA with the above quote, and IMO that's what makes this board fun. When the show was airing, we had separate threads re. Pro-Josh & Pro-Nick clues. I hope we will continue this for the seasons to come.

[jlccaz]

For one person, something could mean one thing and then another thing for someone else.  

I never intended to start a debate about who's  responsible for spoiling this season, so that's why I stated in my original post "it's my opinion and my opinion only".
ITA with the above quote, and IMO that's what makes this board fun. When the show was airing, we had separate threads re. Pro-Josh & Pro-Nick clues. I hope we will continue this for the seasons to come.

Being tape recorded in a public place saying (in words or substance) "I just finished filming the Bachelorette, I met her parents, but she picked the other guy" can't really mean anything but ... just that! Quacks like a duck, walks like a duck, has feathers and webbed feet and associates with ducks. And boardies were able to fill hours and threads debating it. Nothing wrong -- it's just a way to pass the time, but people find the "other" meaning, even when there is really no other way to rationally look at the evidence.

[isittrue]

Perhaps if Elan had not been involved with 2 other airplane pranks, the controversy of whether the plane video of Nick was real would have been easier to dismiss.  But it's a moot point and the plane video was indeed real.  Like stated above something can mean something for one person and mean something different for someone else.  It's all subjective and it is what makes this board hopping 

[GuardianAngel]

For one person, something could mean one thing and then another thing for someone else.  

I never intended to start a debate about who's  responsible for spoiling this season, so that's why I stated in my original post "it's my opinion and my opinion only".
ITA with the above quote, and IMO that's what makes this board fun. When the show was airing, we had separate threads re. Pro-Josh & Pro-Nick clues. I hope we will continue this for the seasons to come.

It will continue! Fan threads are not for everyone, therefore we also have discussion threads for general discussions. IMO it's the best way to run a forum, even though tempers rise at times. There is a place, I hope, for everyone around here.

Whatever the obsession, that is the whole idea of a forum such as this one, a place to park your fanny and enjoy hours of online time if you choose to. I know it was difficult at times to keep topics on track, especially in the Nick thread, but there will always be a favourite F1/F2 and therefore the insanity will continue.

Nick threads consisted of a wide variety of opinions that results/resulted in good dialogue between everyone, which is what we want!

[Kashathediva]

sdmom. ... I have to agree w your comment on the Murray family SM.   While I thought Nick's video could go either way, it was their constant tweets revealing Josh f1 that I couldn't reconcile in my mind. So while I hoped for aNick F1 ending, I was not at all surprised w Josh F1.  Although, I so hoped Mura and Team Nick were right!    Post show, seeing more of Nick, I think her princess behavior would've driven him crazy. It is honestly not a slam against Andi, but it just seems to be who she is at this point. But the good part about that is Josh doesn't seem to mind.

I think Nick and Andi's over thinking everything would have driven both of them crazy. Everything works out for a reason.  Except for the tweet to Hy about hoping to meet his daughter I thought the Murrays stayed fairly quiet.  What Josh's mother put on FB just showed a proud mother which was no different than many other past contestants including Shay (Sean's sister).

With all due respect, I would have to disagree about Mrs. Murray staying silent on SM.  Even Josh fans were proclaiming their glee for all the clues that she provided during the season.  Even her quote about one of her sons possibly getting engaged on the day of FRC was very obvious.  I am sure she is a proud mom but I think her SM let many of us know under no certain terms that her son was the winner.  And we know that no one would book a finale viewing party if her son was left broken-hearted at the FRC.  

It was MM's SMD(social media diarrhea) that had me convinced of the who the F1/F2 would be.

[sdmom]

We had thousands of posts discussing the plane video. If everyone had believed it's real, then there would be nothing for us to talk about, but it would have made the lives of the mods easier!   

BTW, Nick just tweeted he will help raising money for a breast cancer patient this Saturday. I remember he also helped in a camp for children of fallen heroes 2 months ago. I am glad to see he's using his fame for good causes.   

[SueSt]

For one person, something could mean one thing and then another thing for someone else.  

I never intended to start a debate about who's  responsible for spoiling this season, so that's why I stated in my original post "it's my opinion and my opinion only".
ITA with the above quote, and IMO that's what makes this board fun. When the show was airing, we had separate threads re. Pro-Josh & Pro-Nick clues. I hope we will continue this for the seasons to come.

Being tape recorded in a public place saying (in words or substance) "I just finished filming the Bachelorette, I met her parents, but she picked the other guy" can't really mean anything but ... just that!   Quacks like a duck, walks like a duck, has feathers and webbed feet and associates with ducks.  And boardies were able to fill hours and threads debating it.  Nothing wrong -- it's just a way to pass the time, but people find the "other" meaning, even when there is really no other way to rationally look at the evidence.  

Again, everyone comes to this board for their own reasons.  I was not one who disregarded the evidence, but chose to look beyond it.  For me, life is journey, not a destination (RW Emerson).... and my personal journey is about the love story.  

And honestly, even if the evidence is real, it didn’t actually guarantee a specific ending, since, like Mesnick, Andi could have changed her mind.  It’s not over till it’s over.... and personally, I’m still waiting for the happy ending to this particular tale...

[soccermom333]

There has rarely been a season with more accumulated, diverse evidence of F1 identity, and yet the fan-base or the contrarians held out for another outcome.  It's laughable really -- Nick was "caught on tape" and that wasn't good enough.  

Also, I completely concur that Josh/family took way too much grief for "leaking" the ending, as compared to others in this or other seasons.   The F2 was in a public airport / airplane flight speaking loudly, for many minutes, about "after the final rose", the names, and all sorts of contractually protected data ... and Lauren Murray somehow ruined the season with some ambiguous posts/tweets supportive of her son?

The show / powers that be have new rules, different tolerances, for social media buzz and chatter related to show contestants during airing than they used to back when the clauses told the girls to delete or deactivate their MySpace accounts!  These contestants -- except for Nick (see above!) -- are largely playing by these new rules.  They accumulate followers/friends over the course of the show airing, and help with word of mouth marketing of the brand and individual episodes.  And sometimes, their posts cross the line of being like clues for the diehards, especially sleuthing boardie types.

Finally, US Weekly (which mostly has the facts straight over the years) and Life & Style basically also spoiled the season a few weeks out, by writing stories that left out the names Josh and Nick but otherwise completely spilled the beans.   The tabloids spilled the season as they almost always do.

Wishful or contrarian thinking abounds season after season among the show-obsessed boardies.  That will never change.  People just disregard whatever they don't want to believe.

   You. Are. The. Best.

Looking back things become very clear. Josh and Andi are soooo happy, Nick and the other guys have all moved on. Everyone is happy.

[Lucas15]

And honestly, even if the evidence is real, it didn’t actually guarantee a specific ending, since, like Mesnick, Andi could have changed her mind.  It’s not over till it’s over.... and personally, I’m still waiting for the happy ending to this particular tale...

And that's where an approach considering this key bit of insight can be helpful:

There has rarely been a season with more accumulated, diverse evidence of F1 identity

If you accept that a single piece of key evidence is real and proves, as in this case who was F1 at the FRC, then you could focus on other evidence (for example SM and travel / lack of travel) to see what's been going on after the FRC.

It's always a good idea to consider all the diverse evidence together rather than separate it.

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