Bachelorette 7 - THE EDIT - Discussion

happyntexas wrote:I just gotta say....never seen Fleiss before. He's kind of a funny looking fellow, isn't he?? MY...MY!!!

:laughingoutlou

These theories are so much for to discuss! I still have trouble thinking that MF got all three: Ashley, JP and Ben to write and talk in their blogs and vlogs in a way that would fit this purpose of pushing JP when it really is Ben, especially added with Ben's tweeting...but then maybe his tweeting is a false lead since he hasn't been shut down and they did get them to do it

ironcat wrote:

Fascinator11 wrote:

ironcat wrote:

Reidiscool wrote:The shortness of JPs 1-1s and his HTD, his competitive edit and Ash's incessant reminders of looking for REAL and not trying to "win" her lead me to think that JP was always going to be her her F2. The Bentley crap, the less than stellar edit of JP, and Ash choosing him against her families wishes just doesn't make sense to me for a JP F1. It is just smoke and mirrors for the audience to think that Ash's picker is broken. She fell for the cad Bentley and now she's going to fall for JP, despite the edited jealousy warnings and the family disapproval.

Here's the thing though. The majority of the audience won't think Ashley's picker is broken if she chooses JP. This idea that he has gotten such a bad edit is only in the opinions of some sleuthers who analyze the edit, but it isn't scaring off the majority of viewers who aren't so alarmed by all of JP's supposed flaws. And I can already predict that in the matchup between Ash's sister and JP, the overall audience will side with JP, and it will probably only make him more endearing to them.

Comparing JP's situation with Kirsten from the Firestone season is problematic. Kirsten was a true villain that whole season, and NOBODY was rooting for her. When she finally got her comeuppance at the hand of Andrew's brother, the viewers cheered. That was exactly the edit the producers were going for. If they are trying to duplicate that reaction this season, they have failed miserably.

I agree that the majority of the viewers do not see JP that way, but I checked out some of the ABC message board and there were a few posts with concerns about JP and his jealousy issues. It's not just some sleuthers on the board who analyze the edit that have that opinion of JP!

Fair enough, but it's far from the majority of viewers, or even a sizable minority that have "issues" with JP. And if that was the direction they were going with the edit, they failed.

If you think that JP was always going to be Ash's F2, who was to be her F1? Or do you mean Bentley? Which I agree, she may have considered him as a possibility only for the first couple of weeks, but she had to have come up with a different F1 by the time they started traveling. So who was it, if not JP?

[b]
This is precisely why i would NEVER do this show. (Not that anyone would want me to.) And it kinda surprises me that someone like Ashley agreed to do it - unless she was swayed by the possibility of paying off loans, not a bad deal.... I am WAY TOO STUBBORN to fall in love "on schedule", and would frankly have a super hard time not feeling like I'd prostituted myself out, especially by the Fantasy Dates. I would almost have to sit the guys down (how, with cameras and producers all around, I'll never know), and tell the guys from day 1, "guys, let's just all have a blast! Let's get to know each other as much as possible during this limited time frame, and if any of you really like me, here's my email/cell #, call me when the taping's done!" And I'd almost have to make sure I kept myself from showing obvious favoritism till after the show. Anything other than that and I think I'd have a hard time sleeping at night. I think Ashley tried her best to maintain some integrity, but to my ears her honesty sometimes came across as harshness. It's very possible she fell in love with JP at first sight.... but my personality tends to view such things as lust at first sight more than anything. Even Jilly (Molly too?) said she & Ed didn't really fall in love till after everything. In the meantime, doors have been closed to other possibilities, in particular to those who have more "late bloomer" personalities. I guess THAT's why I come to resent this show.... both DH and myself tend to fall into the "late bloomer"/intospective category.... and I suspect I resent people who don't have patience with our kind....sigh... Maybe I'll design a dating show for late bloomers ...
Now of course if Ben is TB, he'll find a way to do this that it's not the least bit sordid or dishonest....LOL.... and he will measure his choices against the highest character standards. LOL...

meauxwalk wrote:

Reidiscool wrote:When you think about it the editors have been rather clever this season, JP's edit has shades of Chantal and Ben is now getting shades of CL's edit. Both were F2s.

Mike Fleiss if you are reading this...ILU.... for keeping me hooked until the end!

From an editing and storytelling standpoint, I think it fits that the F2 guys are both edited as "F2."

It fits with Ashley's early statements that Bentley was her early F1 pick. For nearly 6 episodes, Bentley was shoved down our throats; Ashley was all about him. We are told that production "nearly stopped" when he left (whether it really did or not) because she was so devastated. Perhaps TPTB are trying to give the impression that, despite her 'closure,' Bentley is still F1--that when he walked away, there were only 'F2's' left.

Having both men go into the FRC with a F2 edit creates doubt that she picks/leaves with anyone (since it implies that there is no F1). This also corresponds to the brief FRC previews that we are getting of her running after someone and saying that the day was ruined.

My question is why is the edit so odd? In some ways, it seems similar to Brad II, where all the previews insinuated that he left alone again, while we were being shown him pursuing Emily. This season we have previews that give the impression that Ashley is alone, and yet we are being shown serious physical chemistry with JP and a budding romance with sensitive Ben. I doubt that Ashley leaves alone, so is this just an attempt to fool everyone, or is it pointing to something else?

Well, maybe this accounts for the wonky edit, and we can all agree that since she did pick someone (we all do agree on this by now, don't we?), the edit was purposely misleading in the case of one guy. I guess we'll continue to debate which guy until the bitter end.

I still think that the original plan was to continue with the Bentley drama (ie, the misconception that Bentley really was the F1) until the very end, and then they had to regroup when the audience abandoned them in droves due to massive backlash against their lead. With Bentley out of the picture as a plot point, and JP already halfway through a F2 edit, while Ben was halfway through a F3 edit, this mishmash is what resulted.

happyntexas wrote:I just gotta say....never seen Fleiss before. He's kind of a funny looking fellow, isn't he?? MY...MY!!!

You know to me both MF and RS look a little alike. Are we sure they aren't related?
Maybe my ILU comment was a little strong...I put it down to lack of fresh air and sunshine these past few weeks!
Our misery will hopefully be over by Monday when the AFTR tapes. Failing that I fully hope it is spoiled unequivocally before the finale so we can watch it with a fresh set of eyes. That has been the modus operandi for the past few seasons after all.

Fresh set of eyes? Where are they selling them? Mine haven't been working too well lately, after days on end in front of this stupid monitor.

Reidiscool wrote:

happyntexas wrote:I just gotta say....never seen Fleiss before. He's kind of a funny looking fellow, isn't he?? MY...MY!!!

You know to me both MF and RS look a little alike. Are we sure they aren't related?
Maybe my ILU comment was a little strong...I put it down to lack of fresh air and sunshine these past few weeks!
Our misery will hopefully be over by Monday when the AFTR tapes. Failing that I fully hope it is spoiled unequivocally before the finale so we can watch it with a fresh set of eyes. That has been the modus operandi for the past few seasons after all.

LOL....they do sorta look alike. I hope it is absolutely spoiled. LOL At this point in the game....I love my guy....but I just want to know, move on, etc. etc.

ironcat wrote:

meauxwalk wrote:

Reidiscool wrote:When you think about it the editors have been rather clever this season, JP's edit has shades of Chantal and Ben is now getting shades of CL's edit. Both were F2s.

Mike Fleiss if you are reading this...ILU.... for keeping me hooked until the end!

From an editing and storytelling standpoint, I think it fits that the F2 guys are both edited as "F2."

It fits with Ashley's early statements that Bentley was her early F1 pick. For nearly 6 episodes, Bentley was shoved down our throats; Ashley was all about him. We are told that production "nearly stopped" when he left (whether it really did or not) because she was so devastated. Perhaps TPTB are trying to give the impression that, despite her 'closure,' Bentley is still F1--that when he walked away, there were only 'F2's' left.

Having both men go into the FRC with a F2 edit creates doubt that she picks/leaves with anyone (since it implies that there is no F1). This also corresponds to the brief FRC previews that we are getting of her running after someone and saying that the day was ruined.

My question is why is the edit so odd? In some ways, it seems similar to Brad II, where all the previews insinuated that he left alone again, while we were being shown him pursuing Emily. This season we have previews that give the impression that Ashley is alone, and yet we are being shown serious physical chemistry with JP and a budding romance with sensitive Ben. I doubt that Ashley leaves alone, so is this just an attempt to fool everyone, or is it pointing to something else?

Well, maybe this accounts for the wonky edit, and we can all agree that since she did pick someone (we all do agree on this by now, don't we?), the edit was purposely misleading in the case of one guy. I guess we'll continue to debate which guy until the bitter end.

I still think that the original plan was to continue with the Bentley drama (ie, the misconception that Bentley really was the F1) until the very end, and then they had to regroup when the audience abandoned them in droves due to massive backlash against their lead. With Bentley out of the picture as a plot point, and JP already halfway through a F2 edit, while Ben was halfway through a F3 edit, this mishmash is what resulted.

I kind of have to agree that the original plan was to have the Bentley drama last until the last episode. The problem was that it backfired on them and they had to change the plan. Her "FU Bentley" ITM was obviously filmed after the season had already wrapped up production. Her hair and makeup were completely different in it. They had to film it in order to get rid of the storyline for good and redeem Ashley. If the whole Bentley drama hadn't backfired, we would've seen a differently edited conversation with him in Hong Kong, and then probably a whole slew of voice overs the whole season with her still pining over Bentley and how she doesn't think this whole process is going to work for her. I say thank goodness that whole thing backfired. :laughingoutlou

bluwavz wrote:

ironcat wrote:

meauxwalk wrote:

Reidiscool wrote:When you think about it the editors have been rather clever this season, JP's edit has shades of Chantal and Ben is now getting shades of CL's edit. Both were F2s.

Mike Fleiss if you are reading this...ILU.... for keeping me hooked until the end!

From an editing and storytelling standpoint, I think it fits that the F2 guys are both edited as "F2."

It fits with Ashley's early statements that Bentley was her early F1 pick. For nearly 6 episodes, Bentley was shoved down our throats; Ashley was all about him. We are told that production "nearly stopped" when he left (whether it really did or not) because she was so devastated. Perhaps TPTB are trying to give the impression that, despite her 'closure,' Bentley is still F1--that when he walked away, there were only 'F2's' left.

Having both men go into the FRC with a F2 edit creates doubt that she picks/leaves with anyone (since it implies that there is no F1). This also corresponds to the brief FRC previews that we are getting of her running after someone and saying that the day was ruined.

My question is why is the edit so odd? In some ways, it seems similar to Brad II, where all the previews insinuated that he left alone again, while we were being shown him pursuing Emily. This season we have previews that give the impression that Ashley is alone, and yet we are being shown serious physical chemistry with JP and a budding romance with sensitive Ben. I doubt that Ashley leaves alone, so is this just an attempt to fool everyone, or is it pointing to something else?

Well, maybe this accounts for the wonky edit, and we can all agree that since she did pick someone (we all do agree on this by now, don't we?), the edit was purposely misleading in the case of one guy. I guess we'll continue to debate which guy until the bitter end.

I still think that the original plan was to continue with the Bentley drama (ie, the misconception that Bentley really was the F1) until the very end, and then they had to regroup when the audience abandoned them in droves due to massive backlash against their lead. With Bentley out of the picture as a plot point, and JP already halfway through a F2 edit, while Ben was halfway through a F3 edit, this mishmash is what resulted.

I kind of have to agree that the original plan was to have the Bentley drama last until the last episode. The problem was that it backfired on them and they had to change the plan. Her "FU Bentley" ITM was obviously filmed after the season had already wrapped up production. Her hair and makeup were completely different in it. They had to film it in order to get rid of the storyline for good and redeem Ashley. If the whole Bentley drama hadn't backfired, we would've seen a differently edited conversation with him in Hong Kong, and then probably a whole slew of voice overs the whole season with her still pining over Bentley and how she doesn't think this whole process is going to work for her. I say thank goodness that whole thing backfired. :laughingoutlou

I don't know that it would have gone on the whole season, but at least HTD's. They made a point of showing Ashley saying, "Who?" when CH brought him up in the last episode.

LOL I know about the eyes.....my guy keeps asking WTH is so interesting on that computer anyway......especially when I just laugh out loud for no reason in the world. I say bachelorette. He just rolls his eyes and says Ohhh Gawd!!

:Woah-hoo:

mnmhughes wrote:

bluwavz wrote:

ironcat wrote:

meauxwalk wrote:

Reidiscool wrote:When you think about it the editors have been rather clever this season, JP's edit has shades of Chantal and Ben is now getting shades of CL's edit. Both were F2s.

Mike Fleiss if you are reading this...ILU.... for keeping me hooked until the end!

From an editing and storytelling standpoint, I think it fits that the F2 guys are both edited as "F2."

It fits with Ashley's early statements that Bentley was her early F1 pick. For nearly 6 episodes, Bentley was shoved down our throats; Ashley was all about him. We are told that production "nearly stopped" when he left (whether it really did or not) because she was so devastated. Perhaps TPTB are trying to give the impression that, despite her 'closure,' Bentley is still F1--that when he walked away, there were only 'F2's' left.

Having both men go into the FRC with a F2 edit creates doubt that she picks/leaves with anyone (since it implies that there is no F1). This also corresponds to the brief FRC previews that we are getting of her running after someone and saying that the day was ruined.

My question is why is the edit so odd? In some ways, it seems similar to Brad II, where all the previews insinuated that he left alone again, while we were being shown him pursuing Emily. This season we have previews that give the impression that Ashley is alone, and yet we are being shown serious physical chemistry with JP and a budding romance with sensitive Ben. I doubt that Ashley leaves alone, so is this just an attempt to fool everyone, or is it pointing to something else?

Well, maybe this accounts for the wonky edit, and we can all agree that since she did pick someone (we all do agree on this by now, don't we?), the edit was purposely misleading in the case of one guy. I guess we'll continue to debate which guy until the bitter end.

I still think that the original plan was to continue with the Bentley drama (ie, the misconception that Bentley really was the F1) until the very end, and then they had to regroup when the audience abandoned them in droves due to massive backlash against their lead. With Bentley out of the picture as a plot point, and JP already halfway through a F2 edit, while Ben was halfway through a F3 edit, this mishmash is what resulted.

I kind of have to agree that the original plan was to have the Bentley drama last until the last episode. The problem was that it backfired on them and they had to change the plan. Her "FU Bentley" ITM was obviously filmed after the season had already wrapped up production. Her hair and makeup were completely different in it. They had to film it in order to get rid of the storyline for good and redeem Ashley. If the whole Bentley drama hadn't backfired, we would've seen a differently edited conversation with him in Hong Kong, and then probably a whole slew of voice overs the whole season with her still pining over Bentley and how she doesn't think this whole process is going to work for her. I say thank goodness that whole thing backfired. :laughingoutlou

I don't know that it would have gone on the whole season, but at least HTD's. They made a point of showing Ashley saying, "Who?" when CH brought him up in the last episode.

I forgot about that. You're right, mostly likely until HTD's. Unless they would've just cut that part out. :laughingoutlou

Could be worse, happy. My hubby blames Bach sites for all the viruses on the computer and is threatening to put a password on the computer. I actually kept this new site a secret from him till recently - he keeps blaming Jokers/RS/FORT lol...

Re: The scramble to change the ending after public outcry against Bentley and Ash..... verrrry interesting observations!! I guess JP took Bentley's leaving as having been "fate" and is indeed grateful Ashley held it together long enough that he could capture her heart....