Re: Episode 5 - 6/20 - Discussion - Thread #1

[jojo47]

I was talking with BlondieGal several seasons back about Brad's first season. Of course, he selected no one even though technically DeAnna was F1 and Jenni was F2. I remarked how puzzled I was that season that DeAnna had clearly gotten both an F1 and an F2 edit which I had never seen before.
Blondie remarked that "the edit reflected there was no love story."

It was like a puzzle piece fell into place for me. I could look back retrospectively at seasons and see what the edit was trying to tell me about the couple's real life relationship. It was a bit startling!

The conclusion that I have found - and it works - is that when the edit is botched up, extremely, and/or wonky - any of these 3 - there is something wrong with the relationship in the real world.

The producers watched this relationship supposedly developing - in all seasons. They get a pretty decent feel for what is going on, and plus they have a psychological handle on these folks. ( It is what it is regardless of how I feel about all of it....)

There may be something to JesseC's panel of past contenders. All of them - with the exception of AshleyS - harped on the contestants being "produced". That is something that may be difficult for us to completely understand since we have never experienced anything remotely like it?

Bloomers, how does the bolded translate to this season? Are you thinking that IF (notice I said "if") Ashley & F1 don't work that Bentley's ghost will be brought into the equation?

[Bloomers]

I was talking with BlondieGal several seasons back about Brad's first season. Of course, he selected no one even though technically DeAnna was F1 and Jenni was F2. I remarked how puzzled I was that season that DeAnna had clearly gotten both an F1 and an F2 edit which I had never seen before.
Blondie remarked that "the edit reflected there was no love story."

It was like a puzzle piece fell into place for me. I could look back retrospectively at seasons and see what the edit was trying to tell me about the couple's real life relationship. It was a bit startling!

The conclusion that I have found - and it works - is that when the edit is botched up, extremely, and/or wonky - any of these 3 - there is something wrong with the relationship in the real world.

The producers watched this relationship supposedly developing - in all seasons. They get a pretty decent feel for what is going on, and plus they have a psychological handle on these folks. ( It is what it is regardless of how I feel about all of it....)

There may be something to JesseC's panel of past contenders. All of them - with the exception of AshleyS - harped on the contestants being "produced". That is something that may be difficult for us to completely understand since we have never experienced anything remotely like it?

Bloomers, how does the bolded translate to this season? Are you thinking that IF (notice I said "if") Ashley & F1 don't work that Bentley's ghost will be brought into the equation?

First, the Bentley drama/situation was too good to pass up, but if we had a strong relationship ala Ali and Roberto, then Bentley would have been played up for the first 2 or 3 episodes in some way similar to all of the past drama characters. However, the fact that Bentley is THE theme of this season and over-rides almost Ashley herself is telling me that the realtionship (love story) between Ashley and F1 which we are going to see develop very quickly in Ep. 7 on is (as someone else said) most likely going to be a fairly quick burn out type love story in real life.
When you have a wonky edit - and this one is crazy wonky - there is something wrong with the love story in real life. The producers are there watching it develop.

Look at last season with Brad and Emily. That was a wonky edit as well. There is no confirmation one way or the other on Brad and Emily. Who knows? However, wasn't that just about the edit with them? What is up with Brad and Emily? What is it with Brad and Emily? He doesn't touch her, he hardily kisses her, they don't really talk to each other, etc.....

Ali's edit was wonky on Frank, but the edit on Roberto was wonderful - ChrisL, as well. We felt that she couldn't go wrong with either guy. Also, Frank didn't take over the whole show as Bentley is doing.

[Guest]

First, the Bentley drama/situation was too good to pass up, but if we had a strong relationship ala Ali and Roberto, then Bentley would have been played up for the first 2 or 3 episodes in some way similar to all of the past drama characters. However, the fact that Bentley is THE theme of this season and over-rides almost Ashley herself is telling me that the realtionship (love story) between Ashley and F1 which we are going to see develop very quickly in Ep. 7 on is (as someone else said) most likely going to be a fairly quick burn out type love story in real life.
When you have a wonky edit - and this one is crazy wonky - there is something wrong with the love story in real life. The producers are there watching it develop.

Look at last season with Brad and Emily. That was a wonky edit as well. There is no confirmation one way or the other on Brad and Emily. Who knows? However, wasn't that just about the edit with them? What is up with Brad and Emily? What is it with Brad and Emily? He doesn't touch her, he hardily kisses her, they don't really talk to each other, etc.....

Ali's edit was wonky on Frank, but the edit on Roberto was wonderful - ChrisL, as well. We felt that she couldn't go wrong with either guy. Also, Frank didn't take over the whole show as Bentley is doing.

My only question with this is when do they edit the show. Using Brad and Emily as the example, they started having problems in the relationship once the show started airing and Emily saw Brad with the other girls. So to say they had a wonky edit because of their real world relationship would kind of imply that they went back to edit the show, or they had not edited all the shows yet. I know they can go back and edit things as the season goes on, so it is possible and I was just wondering your thoughts on that.

[anders]

It has been common knowledge in the past that editing can happen right up until the Friday before airing - I'm not sure if that happens every season, but it's highly likely.

[Bloomers]

First, the Bentley drama/situation was too good to pass up, but if we had a strong relationship ala Ali and Roberto, then Bentley would have been played up for the first 2 or 3 episodes in some way similar to all of the past drama characters. However, the fact that Bentley is THE theme of this season and over-rides almost Ashley herself is telling me that the realtionship (love story) between Ashley and F1 which we are going to see develop very quickly in Ep. 7 on is (as someone else said) most likely going to be a fairly quick burn out type love story in real life.
When you have a wonky edit - and this one is crazy wonky - there is something wrong with the love story in real life. The producers are there watching it develop.

Look at last season with Brad and Emily. That was a wonky edit as well. There is no confirmation one way or the other on Brad and Emily. Who knows? However, wasn't that just about the edit with them? What is up with Brad and Emily? What is it with Brad and Emily? He doesn't touch her, he hardily kisses her, they don't really talk to each other, etc.....

Ali's edit was wonky on Frank, but the edit on Roberto was wonderful - ChrisL, as well. We felt that she couldn't go wrong with either guy. Also, Frank didn't take over the whole show as Bentley is doing.

My only question with this is when do they edit the show. Using Brad and Emily as the example, they started having problems in the relationship once the show started airing and Emily saw Brad with the other girls. So to say they had a wonky edit because of their real world relationship would kind of imply that they went back to edit the show, or they had not edited all the shows yet. I know they can go back and edit things as the season goes on, so it is possible and I was just wondering your thoughts on that.

I am not an authority on this, but it is my understanding that they film the whole thing first; thus, they know the F1. Then, they go back and begin editing to come up with their story.
They are telling a story, but what we have found in several seasons is that the edit appears to kind of forecast or predict what is going to happen in the real life relationship. Of course, it can't make it happen!

I will give you a couple of classic examples: Tessa was strongly edited as reluctant and hesitant, and in their real life relationship, she shipped some of her things over to Hawaii to Andy's apartment, but she was reluctant to ever make that final move in severing everything in San Francisco and moving out to Hawaii. They eventually broke up.

Ian was edited as telling Meredith he was not the guy to propose to her. Ian was edited as having quit his job and traveling around. The edit was indicating that although Ian did propose to Meredith, he did not want to commit himself in life to settlement. In a media interview, Ian said that he had lived with his ex-girlfriend for 5 years and had not told her he loved her.
In the fall of the year, Meredith was interviewed and asked when they were going to marry, and she said she thought after the new year; however shortly after the new year, the announcement came that they were asking for privacy for the break-up of their engagement. To me the edit was pointing to the fact that Ian was not in a place in his life where he really wanted to commit and settle down to marriage.

[pavalygurl]

I went back and checked MF's tweets and he has on May 3 "Working on episode 3 Killer....." So I guess they do edit somewhat as they go.

He also listed on April 27 "I take that back, this IS the most shocking rose ceremony ever". He had previously tweeted it might be the most shocking.

Were they in Hong Kong on April 27?

[Guest]

First, the Bentley drama/situation was too good to pass up, but if we had a strong relationship ala Ali and Roberto, then Bentley would have been played up for the first 2 or 3 episodes in some way similar to all of the past drama characters. However, the fact that Bentley is THE theme of this season and over-rides almost Ashley herself is telling me that the realtionship (love story) between Ashley and F1 which we are going to see develop very quickly in Ep. 7 on is (as someone else said) most likely going to be a fairly quick burn out type love story in real life.
When you have a wonky edit - and this one is crazy wonky - there is something wrong with the love story in real life. The producers are there watching it develop.

Look at last season with Brad and Emily. That was a wonky edit as well. There is no confirmation one way or the other on Brad and Emily. Who knows? However, wasn't that just about the edit with them? What is up with Brad and Emily? What is it with Brad and Emily? He doesn't touch her, he hardily kisses her, they don't really talk to each other, etc.....

Ali's edit was wonky on Frank, but the edit on Roberto was wonderful - ChrisL, as well. We felt that she couldn't go wrong with either guy. Also, Frank didn't take over the whole show as Bentley is doing.

My only question with this is when do they edit the show. Using Brad and Emily as the example, they started having problems in the relationship once the show started airing and Emily saw Brad with the other girls. So to say they had a wonky edit because of their real world relationship would kind of imply that they went back to edit the show, or they had not edited all the shows yet. I know they can go back and edit things as the season goes on, so it is possible and I was just wondering your thoughts on that.

I am not an authority on this, but it is my understanding that they film the whole thing first; thus, they know the F1. Then, they go back and begin editing to come up with their story.
They are telling a story, but what we have found in several seasons is that the edit appears to kind of forecast or predict what is going to happen in the real life relationship. Of course, it can't make it happen!

I will give you a couple of classic examples: Tessa was strongly edited as reluctant and hesitant, and in their real life relationship, she shipped some of her things over to Hawaii to Andy's apartment, but she was reluctant to ever make that final move in severing everything in San Francisco and moving out to Hawaii. They eventually broke up.

Ian was edited as telling Meredith he was not the guy to propose to her. Ian was edited as having quit his job and traveling around. The edit was indicating that although Ian did propose to Meredith, he did not want to commit himself in life to settlement. In a media interview, Ian said that he had lived with his ex-girlfriend for 5 years and had not told her he loved her.
In the fall of the year, Meredith was interviewed and asked when they were going to marry, and she said she thought after the new year; however shortly after the new year, the announcement came that they were asking for privacy for the break-up of their engagement. To me the edit was pointing to the fact that Ian was not in a place in his life where he really wanted to commit and settle down to marriage.

So do you have a guess as to what the edit is pointing to this time? Do you think it all revolves around Bentley?

[Bloomers]

First, the Bentley drama/situation was too good to pass up, but if we had a strong relationship ala Ali and Roberto, then Bentley would have been played up for the first 2 or 3 episodes in some way similar to all of the past drama characters. However, the fact that Bentley is THE theme of this season and over-rides almost Ashley herself is telling me that the realtionship (love story) between Ashley and F1 which we are going to see develop very quickly in Ep. 7 on is (as someone else said) most likely going to be a fairly quick burn out type love story in real life.
When you have a wonky edit - and this one is crazy wonky - there is something wrong with the love story in real life. The producers are there watching it develop.

Look at last season with Brad and Emily. That was a wonky edit as well. There is no confirmation one way or the other on Brad and Emily. Who knows? However, wasn't that just about the edit with them? What is up with Brad and Emily? What is it with Brad and Emily? He doesn't touch her, he hardily kisses her, they don't really talk to each other, etc.....

Ali's edit was wonky on Frank, but the edit on Roberto was wonderful - ChrisL, as well. We felt that she couldn't go wrong with either guy. Also, Frank didn't take over the whole show as Bentley is doing.

My only question with this is when do they edit the show. Using Brad and Emily as the example, they started having problems in the relationship once the show started airing and Emily saw Brad with the other girls. So to say they had a wonky edit because of their real world relationship would kind of imply that they went back to edit the show, or they had not edited all the shows yet. I know they can go back and edit things as the season goes on, so it is possible and I was just wondering your thoughts on that.

I am not an authority on this, but it is my understanding that they film the whole thing first; thus, they know the F1. Then, they go back and begin editing to come up with their story.
They are telling a story, but what we have found in several seasons is that the edit appears to kind of forecast or predict what is going to happen in the real life relationship. Of course, it can't make it happen!

I will give you a couple of classic examples: Tessa was strongly edited as reluctant and hesitant, and in their real life relationship, she shipped some of her things over to Hawaii to Andy's apartment, but she was reluctant to ever make that final move in severing everything in San Francisco and moving out to Hawaii. They eventually broke up.

Ian was edited as telling Meredith he was not the guy to propose to her. Ian was edited as having quit his job and traveling around. The edit was indicating that although Ian did propose to Meredith, he did not want to commit himself in life to settlement. In a media interview, Ian said that he had lived with his ex-girlfriend for 5 years and had not told her he loved her.
In the fall of the year, Meredith was interviewed and asked when they were going to marry, and she said she thought after the new year; however shortly after the new year, the announcement came that they were asking for privacy for the break-up of their engagement. To me the edit was pointing to the fact that Ian was not in a place in his life where he really wanted to commit and settle down to marriage.

So do you have a guess as to what the edit is pointing to this time? Do you think it all revolves around Bentley?

This of course is my personal opinion - up front candidly. I am putting what I am seeing together with what I saw in last season's edit with Brad, and I just don't think Ashley is really ready for a steady, settle -down, committed relationship that is going to work itself into marriage and kids - and I have no problem with it.
She is young, and she still hasn't finished dental school, let alone figured out where she wants to practice or begun to try to set up a practice.

Ashley is plenty booksmart, but I don't see her as life ready. She flits around, and she is so insecure and unsure of herself. Whether the producers have exaggerated the Bentley situation or not, she still was warned by someone who had no reason to lie to her, and she completely ignored the warning, and allowed herself to fall for a smooth operator.

The producers, Fleiss in particular according to his interviews, want an engagement, so I think we will see an engagement. I also think we will see a relatively short-lived relationship. The producers have a way of "encouraging" a relationship to exist until certain points, but I just don't think Ashley is at that point.
I do think if DWTS is offered to her, she will welcome that opportunity with open arms because of her love of dance and maybe to help pay some of her school bills.
(Also, I don't know how true this is, but I heard once that 1 dental chair can cost up to $80K to equip. Yikes! She may need to start saving now for that practice....)

I think if the producers felt that the F1 relationship was truly sturdy in the vein of Ali and Roberto, we would not have seen the emphasis on Bentley into the 6th episode. Since we are, I think we are seeing a relationship that will not stand the test of time. As someone else said, " A love that develops quick ( after Bentley leaves) and burns out just as quick."

[Guest]

Thanks for your insight Bloomers. It makes total sense and only time will tell. Unfortunately the odds are against them from the get go anyways.

[mnmhughes]

Thanks for your insight Bloomers. It makes total sense and only time will tell. Unfortunately the odds are against them from the get go anyways.

I hope the F1 has a well-thought-out response to the question he's going to be asked most after this is all over: "What do you think about Bentley? More importantly, what do you think about Ashley's reaction to Bentley?"
I have a feeling after this is all said and done, we're still going to be hearing more about Bentley than anyone else.

[pavalygurl]

[quote="mnmhughes"]

Thanks for your insight Bloomers. It makes total sense and only time will tell. Unfortunately the odds are against them from the get go anyways.

I hope the F1 has a well-thought-out response to the question he's going to be asked most after this is all over: "What do you think about Bentley? More importantly, what do you think about Ashley's reaction to Bentley?"
I have a feeling after this is all said and done, we're still going to be hearing more about Bentley than anyone else. [/quote]

Which really "chaps my azz" as JP would say.

[Guest]

I found, after rewatching the group date, JP making very similar types of comments as past F2s have made and really close to the kind that Chris L would make. Per this past week I would put Ben as f1 and JP as f2 based on his comments and some behavior as well

That is another reason why I am doubting that JP is F1.........waaaay too many comments made by JP that belongs to a F2 edit. That and I have always had a healthy sceptism when it comes to RS and his final 1 spoilers..........he has been wrong more than right.

Agreed - JP could be F1 but right now he's not getting a F1 edit. This season is proving to be difficult to determine a f1 from the edit, but I'm hoping once it's down to F4 and the majority of the drama is over that things start to fall into place - especially after Bentley is permanently gone.

Actually, I did the numbers and RS has been right 60% of the time - he was right about Jason dumping Melissa for Molly, right that Jake picked Vienna, right that Chris L was F2, wrong that Ali was single and wrong that Chantal was F1.

Didn't RS say that no one was chosen with Ali's season and he was sticking to it, then later, changed his mind, after it was proven on Fort that she did choose Roberto and Chris L was F2, then he said that HE found that out.........as far as I am concerned with his scores, he has only been right with Jason/Melissa/Molly. Other than that, he either didn't have it right or continually changed his mind. Therefore I am really taking his info with a grain of salt and making my own assumptions/observations. I really do feel from what my sources have provided that something's up with the final 1...........we have sc of Ryan in Fiji, we have a voice over of him there as well. We have a SC of what we are assuming to be Constantine per the shorts he wore in Phuket, at a waterfall in Fiji, we have other sources than RS confirming that we have HTD's for Constantine and Ben. We have no confirmed htd for Ames and JP, no confirmed JP sitings/sc's in Fiji, just a VO. IMO, we have a lot holes to be filled. and properly sleuthed out.

correct me if I'm wrong, but he was right when he said Chris L was F2 and he was right when he said Jake picked Vienna - I don't intend to argue, only that he has been more right than wrong - and because he has been wrong we all have to take his info with a grain of salt and continue to sleuth - I'm not sold that JP is F1, he could be, but I'm not seeing it.

He said nothing about who was the one chosen during Ali's season..........he said she chose NO ONE, then changed his mind a few days after it was sleuthed on fort that she did choose someone and it was Roberto. I do believe that he did have it right from the beginning with Jake and Vienna. That's my point.........I am looking at who he said from the beginning and not who he changed his mind about at a later date.........

and if you read the bolded you'll see that's exactly what I said. We're both right - why are you harping on this?

I am "harping on" about it as there are some on here that are defending RS and I feel he is more wrong than right!!!!!

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