Episode 12 - 7/22 - Bachelorette 8 - ATFR (Live) - Discussion

And yes, everyone's entitled to revel in their hostility

I understand why Emily wouldn't open the package and read Arie's journal. I also understand why some would disagree with me on this. I also understand why, presented with an unexpected phone call from Arie, Emily might not have been thinking on her feet & advising Arie to not leave the parcel with her. At the moment, she might have been flummoxed.

What I don't understand is this: after thinking it over for a cpl days (or hours), why didn't she just mail the package back to him with a note of explanation? And if she was discussing Arie's call with Jef, why didn't the two of them decide to mail it back? Why did the two of them decide to notify TPTB instead? Or was it unavoidable, like does a handler live with emily or screen all her calls/mail/pkgs while the season is airing?

tigertiz wrote:

And yes, everyone's entitled to revel in their hostility

Thanks for the permission. Oh - You are not a moderator. Excuse me.

LOVE ME and SAN - thanks for the permission to say what I wish to about contestants on this show.

JBF wrote:

Again, she was zeroing in on Jef early on and Ricki was the deciding factor. That kid was all over Jef in a way she wasn't with Brad. In fact, Emily was probably struggling to imagine Arie with her even though she kept saying she was confident he and Ricki would get along. Remember too that Jef, not Arie, was on the Muppet date that Ricki attended (and she did see Jef even if she didn't meet him) and playing with kids on the second group date. As a result, Emily already had The Image in her mind.

I can’t fault Emily for letting Arie go at his LCD. I can’t even blame her for the lack of closure she gave him while they were at the Botanic Garden – she was a wreck, and I am sure that impacted her to some degree. If anything, I am thankful that she made up her mind early and spared him the humiliation of the FRC. What I can and DO fault her for is the way she handled everything since then.

As soon as we learned that Arie actually flew to NC in an attempt to either win her back or get some closure, the tears finally started to flow for me. The type of love and passion that Arie felt (feels?) for Emily is such a gift. It drove him to fight for her. It drove him to completely put himself out there and open himself up to more hurt. It was risky. It left him completely bare and exposed. Yet he managed to find the strength to stop himself from potentially disrupting Ricki’s life. So instead he called Emily and told her he was in town. I gather that he told her he wouldn’t disrupt her life, but wanted her to read the journal he had been keeping. So he left it on her doorstep.

Can we just pause for a second and reenact this scenario in our minds?

This amazing man, his heart in pieces, still feels so strongly for Emily that he books a flight across the country to see her. To fight for her. To prove to her that he loves her with all his heart. That she is his soul mate. He had to be a nervous wreck. What if she isn’t there? What if she won’t see him? What if he was wrong and she doesn’t feel the same? What if, despite everything, she still doesn’t love him back? A million “what ifs” running through his mind as his plane touches down. And then what? He has to see Emily. He has to see her smiling face. He has to be near her. He has to prove to her how he feels. That it was real. That it IS real. But what about Ricki? What if she is home? What will she think about a strange man showing up to see her mom? What will Emily think? He doesn’t want to disrupt their lives, so he takes a step back. He breathes. He calls Emily. He tells her he is in town, desperate to see her, but doesn’t want to upset her or Ricki. They compromise. Arie tells her that he kept a journal during the show and he wants her to read it. He knows it will leave him raw and exposed, but it will prove his feelings for her are real. It appears that she agrees to read it, because he drops it off at her doorstep. AT HER DOORSTEP. He is standing at her doorstep. So close to the woman he loves. Close to the only person that can either heal his heart OR give him closure. And he can do nothing but drop off his journal and walk away. So he does. He leaves NC, hoping that she will read his words. Hoping that she will see his true feelings. Hoping…

And then she throws it back in his face (unread) at the LIVE ATFR special. In front of a million TV viewers.

Are you F#@%ing kidding me?!?

That part of their journey should have remained private and completely off camera. I don’t care what their contracts say, as the lead Emily had the power to keep this private. If she had one once of respect for Arie – just one ounce – she would have insisted this be kept off camera. Then again, if she had one once of respect for him, she would have read his journal.

That journal wasn’t about Emily – it was about ARIE. He needed closure. He needed to know that he did everything in his power to prove to Emily that he loved her. He needed to know that there was nothing he could have done differently. Nothing he could have said differently. He needed to have no regrets. If he knew he did everything in his power to prove his love, and she STILL didn’t pick him, then he could let go. Choosing to share his private and most innermost thoughts with her was his way of doing that. She didn’t respect him enough to do that for him. Then she rubbed it in his face by bringing the whole thing public.

And he still managed to handle himself with class.

Arie Luyendyk Jr. has more class in his pinky finger than Emily does in her whole body.

ironcat wrote:I think when Emily said she felt more confident that it would work out with Jef, it was her way of saying that she felt she and Jef were just more compatible overall than she and Arie were, in terms of lifestyle, values, culture, families meshing, etc. And I suspect she's correct. She was in "Bachelor love" with both of them, which even the successful couples have admitted isn't enough, and you have to fall in love FOR REALZ after the show is over. So rather than get hung up on that, she based her decision on which guy she saw a smoother future with, and that was Jef. Had her feelings for Arie been stronger, none of the rest of it would have mattered, but clearly they weren't, or she wouldn't have dumped him.

Regarding Arie's journal, I certainly understand why he left it on her door, and if Emily was having ANY second thoughts about her decision at any point over the past few months, she would have read it. But apparently she wasn't, and as a result, it would have been highly disrespectful to have done so, so I'm not at all surprised that she never even opened the package.

There's no telling what the future will hold, but I have no doubt that this couple is sincerely happy and truly believes that they are soulmates right now, and they expect it to work out. If the fact that they (I suspect it's largely coming from Jef) are more circumspect in their PDAs than some other couples makes them less interesting to watch for some viewers, or causes these viewers to doubt or denigrate their relationship, so be it. I'm sure Jem couldn't care less. And from the smiles on their faces tonight, I suspect that things are going quite well in that department for both of them in private. :giggle:

Amberish wrote:

ironcat wrote:I think when Emily said she felt more confident that it would work out with Jef, it was her way of saying that she felt she and Jef were just more compatible overall than she and Arie were, in terms of lifestyle, values, culture, families meshing, etc. And I suspect she's correct. She was in "Bachelor love" with both of them, which even the successful couples have admitted isn't enough, and you have to fall in love FOR REALZ after the show is over. So rather than get hung up on that, she based her decision on which guy she saw a smoother future with, and that was Jef. Had her feelings for Arie been stronger, none of the rest of it would have mattered, but clearly they weren't, or she wouldn't have dumped him.

Regarding Arie's journal, I certainly understand why he left it on her door, and if Emily was having ANY second thoughts about her decision at any point over the past few months, she would have read it. But apparently she wasn't, and as a result, it would have been highly disrespectful to have done so, so I'm not at all surprised that she never even opened the package.

There's no telling what the future will hold, but I have no doubt that this couple is sincerely happy and truly believes that they are soulmates right now, and they expect it to work out. If the fact that they (I suspect it's largely coming from Jef) are more circumspect in their PDAs than some other couples makes them less interesting to watch for some viewers, or causes these viewers to doubt or denigrate their relationship, so be it. I'm sure Jem couldn't care less. And from the smiles on their faces tonight, I suspect that things are going quite well in that department for both of them in private. :giggle:

Very thoughtful post.

Not sure about Emily only in Bachelor Love when filming concluded in that, I think Emily did fall in love with Jef where she didn't really with Arie. I do believe Emily's eyes gives her away.

beader wrote:

HowSoonIsNow wrote:I understand why Emily wouldn't open the package and read Arie's journal. I also understand why some would disagree with me on this. I also understand why, presented with an unexpected phone call from Arie, Emily might not have been thinking on her feet & advising Arie to not leave the parcel with her. At the moment, she might have been flummoxed.

What I don't understand is this: after thinking it over for a cpl days (or hours), why didn't she just mail the package back to him with a note of explanation? And if she was discussing Arie's call with Jef, why didn't the two of them decide to mail it back? Why did the two of them decide to notify TPTB instead? Or was it unavoidable, like does a handler live with emily or screen all her calls/mail/pkgs while the season is airing?

The bolded would require them caring more for Arie than the publicity for themselves.

livlafluv1 wrote:

Metronomy wrote:

beader wrote:

HowSoonIsNow wrote:I understand why Emily wouldn't open the package and read Arie's journal. I also understand why some would disagree with me on this. I also understand why, presented with an unexpected phone call from Arie, Emily might not have been thinking on her feet & advising Arie to not leave the parcel with her. At the moment, she might have been flummoxed.

What I don't understand is this: after thinking it over for a cpl days (or hours), why didn't she just mail the package back to him with a note of explanation? And if she was discussing Arie's call with Jef, why didn't the two of them decide to mail it back? Why did the two of them decide to notify TPTB instead? Or was it unavoidable, like does a handler live with emily or screen all her calls/mail/pkgs while the season is airing?

The bolded would require them caring more for Arie than the publicity for themselves.

There's been no evidence that they contacted TPTB about it. Why jump to that conclusion? Do we even know if there was a return address on the package? Again, jumping to conclusions.

Anyone with internet access can locate addresses without too much trouble. Heck Emily's home address was posted on the boards during Brad 2.0 (not saying I agree with that) Returning it in public was a choice.

gurlbrit wrote:

better wrote:

HowSonIsNow wrote:I understand why Emily wouldn't open the package and read Arie's journal. I also understand why some would disagree with me on this. I also understand why, presented with an unexpected phone call from Arie, Emily might not have been thinking on her feet & advising Arie to not leave the parcel with her. At the moment, she might have been flummoxed.

What I don't understand is this: after thinking it over for a cpl days (or hours), why didn't she just mail the package back to him with a note of explanation? And if she was discussing Arie's call with Jef, why didn't the two of them decide to mail it back? Why did the two of them decide to notify TPTB instead? Or was it unavoidable, like does a handler live with emily or screen all her calls/mail/packages while the season is airing?

The bolded would require them caring more for Arie than the publicity for themselves.

So what do y'all think is the reason for TPTB displaying this stuff?


I think that she called TPTB when Arie called her and they JUST COULDN'T RESIST the drama associated with it. I'm pretty sure that TPTB got hold of Arie's journal and kept it until just the right moment; hence deciding a couple of weeks ago that the AFTR and Finale would be broadcast live on a Sunday evening. It's all about drama and ratings, and this is ratings gold.

gurlbrit wrote:

beader wrote:

HowSoonIsNow wrote:I understand why Emily wouldn't open the package and read Arie's journal. I also understand why some would disagree with me on this. I also understand why, presented with an unexpected phone call from Arie, Emily might not have been thinking on her feet & advising Arie to not leave the parcel with her. At the moment, she might have been flummoxed.

What I don't understand is this: after thinking it over for a cpl days (or hours), why didn't she just mail the package back to him with a note of explanation? And if she was discussing Arie's call with Jef, why didn't the two of them decide to mail it back? Why did the two of them decide to notify TPTB instead? Or was it unavoidable, like does a handler live with emily or screen all her calls/mail/pkgs while the season is airing?

The bolded would require them caring more for Arie than the publicity for themselves.

So what do y'all think is the reason for TPTB displaying this stuff?

I think that she called TPTB when Arie called her and they JUST COULDN'T RESIST the drama associated with it. I'm pretty sure that TPTB got hold of Arie's journal and kept it until just the right moment; hence deciding a couple of weeks ago that the AFTR and Finale would be broadcast live on a Sunday evening. It's all about drama and ratings, and this is ratings gold.